AD #1143 – Fired Chrysler Worker is Rehired, Dodge to Drop Avenger? New GMC Sierra Denali

May 29th, 2013 at 11:51am

Runtime: 9:08

Chrysler quietly hires back a UAW worker it fired, after his dismissal caused an outcry. According to one source, Dodge is going to drop its best selling model, the Avenger. Unlike the new Silverado there’s no mistaking the new 2014 GMC Sierra Denali with the old one. All that and more, plus host John McElroy responds to your questions and comments in this week’s edition of You Said It!

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Welcome to Autoline Daily as we keep you up to date on the latest developments in the global automotive industry.

Back in March Chrysler fired a UAW worker because he publicly protested the new work schedule at one of the company’s stamping plants and blabbed about the production status. Well, Chrysler just quietly hired him back. Of course, anyone who watches Autoline This Week knew it was coming. When we had UAW President, Bob King on the show we asked him about this very situation. He pretty much told us the guy was getting his job back.

Speaking of Chrysler, it’s going to drop the Dodge Avenger according to the Detroit Free Press. If you ask me, that’s kind of a risky move because it’s the best selling model in the Dodge lineup. In its place the company is going to move production of the Dodge Journey out of Mexico to the plant in Sterling Heights, Michigan where the Avenger was made. That plant is also home to the Chrysler 200. The Journey will be redesigned to go on the Alfa-Romeo Giulietta platform, as will the upcoming Chrysler 200. And of course the Dodge Dart is based on that platform. Insiders say the new Chrysler 200 is the most dramatically styled car to come out of the company in a long time.

Is BMW looking at moving more upscale? At the 2013 Concorso d’Eleganza Villa d’Este, BMW and Pininfarina unveiled a special one-off vehicle called the Gran Lusso Coupé. This long, sleek looking car is the interpretation of a BMW coupe seen through the eyes of Pininfarina. Looking at the front end they must be big fans of Shark Week on the Discovery Channel. The four-seater’s interior is wrapped in premium Italian leather and even features wood trim that’s aged for thousands of years. While there aren’t plans to sell it at the moment, WardsAuto reports that the company would consider it, if research showed they could find 5,000 buyers willing to pay 200,000 euros.

A few years back we showed you a walking assist device Honda developed for physical therapy patients. Now the company is leasing 100 devices to hospitals in Japan for rehab patients and to get real-world feedback. It helps users walk with a computer that activates motors based on hip angle sensors. The device weighs about six pounds and is powered by a lithium-ion battery that lasts 60 minutes per charge.

Well we have seen the Chevy Silverado and its High Country variant. Now it’s GMC’s turn. This is the 2014 GMC Sierra Denali. While mechanically no different from the Silverado, the Denali does have much more contemporary styling. Unlike the new Silverado there’s no mistaking the new Denali with the old one. I think the Silverado is a great truck, but why they styled it so closely to the old one is a puzzle to me. My bet is that on a percentage basis, the new Sierra will do better than the new Silverado.

Coming up next, it’s time for You Said It!

Pedro Fernandez saw Autoline This Week where the topic was about making vehicles lighter and had this reaction to Carla Bailo, the head of product planning for Nissan in the Americas. “The Nissan lady and others speak of the need for lighter cars, but in actuality, they’re all getting heavier and bigger, when are we gonna start seeing these so-called ‘lighter’ vehicles?” Pedro, it’s starting to happen. For example, I believe the new Nissan Altima is the lightest car in its class. But to your point, we’re not going to see dramatic reductions in weight reduction until 2017 or so. That’s when the fuel economy standards really start to ramp up. And that’s when new car prices are going to go up as dramatically because those light weight materials are going to add a lot of cost.

fatboy19831 was impressed by Carla Bailo. “Nice to see women that are at the top of their field in the automotive world.” As an industry we’re getting there fatboy, slowly, but we’re getting there.

revampted wants to know, “Is Chevy still going to make a Colorado diesel for the US market?” When we had Mike Siegrist, on Autoline After Hours last week talking about the Chevy Cruze Diesel, we asked him about that kind of application. All he would say is that he can’t talk about future product. And that suggests to me that a Colorado Diesel is part of that future product.

GHOSTJERKER wants to know why Porsche would price the new 918 at $845,000. “Why not round the price up to $918,000? Consistent with it’s 918 units, 9/18 release date. Round the horsepower to 918 while you’re at it.” Listen up Porsche, I think Ghost is on to something. And I’m sure they’d still sell out if you raised the price by $73,000.

Todd T has some interesting insight on that report we covered from the website 24/7 Wall Street which predicted Mitsubishi, Volvo and Road & Track would go out of business in the American market. “You should know the moron running 24/7 Wall Street is also the one that predicted KIA would leave the market a few years ago. It was what caused the dismissal of a great PR guy from Kia. This guy ONLY cares about making sensational headlines, I for one would be sincerely grateful if you didn’t help him.” Todd, thanks for that input. We will never repeat anything from that website again, I promise you.

Wayne had this to say about Ford’s announcement it will stop manufacturing in Australia. “Sad to hear the news. We in this part of the world will miss Ford and of course it may also mean that Holden will follow soon after, leaving a big hole in the employment and economy of Australia. We will still be able to buy imported models but the cost will be so much more. Not only in dollar terms.” We agree Wayne. It’s the end of an era and sad to see. However, I’m not so pessimistic about Holden because it manages to export a good part of its production, and that gives it the economy of scale to be profitable. Ford never really exported cars like Holden does.

Thanks for all your letters and comments. We truly like reading them all.

Say before we go I want to remind you that our guest on Autoline After Hours tomorrow night is Jeff Owens, the Chief Technology Officer at Delphi and he has some interesting technology to talk about. So if you’ve got questions about the kind of technology automakers are working on, tomorrow night is your chance to ask them.

But that wraps up today’s report. Thanks for watching, we’ll see you tomorrow.

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87 Comments to “AD #1143 – Fired Chrysler Worker is Rehired, Dodge to Drop Avenger? New GMC Sierra Denali”

  1. G.A.Branigan Says:

    I like the frontend of the new chevy better then the gmc version.I hate how gaudy the jimmy looks.For me,less is more.

  2. G.A.Branigan Says:

    The new Colorado with a diesel? I won’t believe it until I see it on the chevy website,although GM doesn’t bull$h!t like the fruitpies at jeep and chrysler do.

  3. pedro fernandez Says:

    That GMC would be great for mowing down zombies when we finally get the apocalypse we’ve been reading about for so long, so now that there will be no more Avenger, what will be the new darling of the rental fleets? you know, the one everyone says, “Oh $hit, not THAT one” when they pick it up at the airport rental agency.

  4. pedro fernandez Says:

    On the subject of lighter cars, I just hope they make the new Journey a bit lighter and more responsive w/o the floaty feeling of the current one, which only gets worse as it ages, it is now as floaty as any car I’ve driving in the past 20 yrs.

  5. G.A.Branigan Says:

    That new GMC grill reminds of the french fry making grate that comes with some of those ‘miracle kitchen aids’,lol.Should work well in the zombie killing mode too ;}>

  6. HtG Says:

    Just think about how much it’s going to cost to insure these future light weight cars. Boy is the used market will have to benefit.(If I may talk up my Civic for a moment; it weighs 2460lbs on a 103″ wheelbase. That’s in 2002 model year pounds and about 14K US dollars. It awaits the arrival of all those future cars.)

  7. pedro fernandez Says:

    I can see a new Pixar movie with this GMC as the title character with its cartoonish, over-the-top grill and they’ll sell a lot of toys as well.

  8. HtG Says:

    “Boy is the used market will have to benefit”

  9. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The 200 will take up the slack as the rental fleet queen. Its sales will probably increase almost as much as the Avenger volume has been, if Chrysler continues to go after the fleet market the same way they have going after it.

  10. Chuck Grenci Says:

    Glittery chrome grills are the ‘norm’ for the Denali; hopefully the standard GMC (pickup) will be a little more restrained. I think I like the old one better (but I’m not in the truck market) so what I say is just an opinion.

    And a comment on lighter vehicles; the one’s that come to mind (recently) have been the newest from Cadillac; ATS and the next CTS. I think the battle will remain, though, more regulation from the ‘feds’ versus more technology (lightening) from the manufacturers; both that will cost more (to us, the consumer).

  11. Kit Gerhart Says:

    GMC is just going after part of the cartoonish, over-the-top grill market which is now owned by Ford and Ram.

  12. HtG Says:

    I’ll bet carcos do a bit of joking behind the scenes about how many tons of excess human hoggage they have to haul around. How much heavier is the average person compared to the early 70′s?

    Biodiesel is PEOPLE!!

  13. pedro fernandez Says:

    By removing the Avenger, Dodge hopes to sell more Darts, whose own worst enemy has been that old Caliber-derived Avenger, more room, more engine for less money. Had a client with a new Avenger, she mentioned more space and driving comfort for the money as the reason she got it over the Dart.

  14. pedro fernandez Says:

    #12 True, if the song “Shake your booty” was to come out now it would be renamed “Shake you caboose”

  15. J Hundertmark Says:

    The GMC Denali reminds me of Ford Truck front end styling. Good thing they put their three letters on the grille as opposed to the other 4 letters.

  16. ColoradoKid Says:

    The new GMC …. which is pretty much just like the old GMC … which is still pretty much just like the ‘ new ‘ Chevy P/U… which is pretty much just like the old Chevy P/U … with a GMC badge on its snout …. for no good reason what so ever …e.g. ….zzzZZZZ

    Speaking of GM …. here’s what IMO is perhaps the best and most balanced commentary on the state of GM to date ;

    Which … pretty much says what I’ve been saying all along . That yes …. things are ‘ better ‘ at GM …. but they’re still not ‘ Good Enough ‘ … with GM being bested in each and every segment .


    The Pininfarina BMW Lusso – To date perhaps the single biggest disappointment styling wise from the House of Pinin .. as well as being a major let down after all the Hype and Hoopla ( trickle marketing & partial reveals ) that proceeded it in the EU/UK press .

    Will it ever be built ? Not unless BMW’s had a major fit of stupidity and wishes to cut into their Rolls Royce sales

    Pininfarina ..first all those Cosmic Jelly Bean Ferrari’s … and now this duller than paint drying BMW . Another great works its way into total obscurity I’m afraid

  17. ColoradoKid Says:

    HtG – 12 – How much heavier has the average US citizen become since the 70′s ? A lot …. actually … a hell of a lot ….. we ( well not us in Colorado .. though even here the tonnage is increasing alarmingly ) are rapidly becoming the most over weight and obese nation on the planet …. Sad thing is …. most Americans are almost proud about that fact ……


    Pedro – 14 – Yeah ….. now days ..”Shake Yer Booty” registers a good 5.0 on the Richter Scale :o

  18. Jon M Says:

    Albeit the best selling model, the Avenger may not be the most profitable. It may not be profitable at all. I for one cannot say, but I do know that the best selling products are not always profitable. I might guess that the Avenger is not returning anything to Chrysler since they are dropping such a model. So it’s either a risky or a fat-trimming move.

  19. Kit Gerhart Says:

    We aren’t becoming the most obese nation on earth. We already are, and have been for some time now:

  20. ColoradoKid Says:

    18 – I was trying to be kind about it …. just in case … you know … ;-)

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    19, OK, thanks….

  22. M360 Says:

    John, the other day while I was texting, it occurred to me that that the Chevrolet “LTZ” model is actually “LuTZ” without the letter “u” – sort of like a texting abbreviation. I wonder how many vehicles GM has produced with Mr. Bob Lutz’s name on them? Do they realize he is a modern day “Ford” with his name right on the cars they produce?

  23. pedro fernandez Says:

    Japan skinniest? really? I would have never picked that one. I’ve seen many chunky Japanese fellers, it must be the women who are keeping the stats down! AS far as the US, just the other day at my local market I saw a fat broad buying a cake using food stamps, I thought to myself, WTF?? since when is cake considered vital nutritional food? Is it in the food pyramid with a candle lit on top?

  24. pedro fernandez Says:

    #22 Yeah, Lutz must be very proud of the Corsica LTZ, an outstanding sample of automotive engineering and execution.

  25. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I hadn’t thought about the possibility of an LTZ model designation/Bob LuTZ connection, but your post made me curious. It looks like there would be no connection. Chevy used the LTZ moniker at least as far back as 1993, on the Caprice LTZ, but Lutz didn’t go from Chrysler to Exide until ’98, or from Exide to GM until ”01.

  26. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Corsica LTZ. It looks like the LTZ moniker started earlier than what I found. That would be as far back as ’87 or ’88.

  27. K Benakole Says:

    Gran Lusso or Grand Loser?

    There’s only three things about this car:
    1. Pininfarina Created Her. 2. BMW
    Breathed life into Her. 3. She Is only a
    Teaser. Period. So BMW wants it. But,
    whoever is rich and privileged enough to
    engage her (she’s not marriable) before
    handing her over to God knows whom or
    what or where should be advancedly
    informed he endorsed a precedent for
    femme fatale. I’m talking from a V12-
    POV. A hood can be wide and long and
    swooping for aesthetic and aerodynamic
    Purposes than just to fit a mammoth,
    blood-thirsty heart whose capabilities are
    overmatched by the very same ones
    those conceiving her are killing. 4 to 6
    cylinders powering this concept is a more
    Sensible and Sensitive engineering!

  28. HtG Says:

    I can imagine future President Carl Levin giving american drivers a global warming/national security tax credit for getting their BMI into the healthy range. As if the farmers wouldn’t sic their Senators/Lobbyist army after him.

    Think about it. Carcos want to take 1000lbs out, but a male that’s 50lbs over his ideal weight is imposing a 5% penalty. We ARE the missing full size spare tire.

    (don’t worry America, Levin won’t be president)

  29. pedro fernandez Says:

    Corsica only car I’ve ever driven in which the dash moved violently up and down over any road imperfection, as if it was ready to come loose! Rough riding without being a good handler at all, to this day I wonder how they achieved this?

  30. pedro fernandez Says:

    Hey, HtG I’m down to 153, do you suppose I could get some tax credit? I leave a very low CO2 footprint on this planet!

  31. HtG Says:

    29 How tall are you, Pedro? Do you smoke? Hypertension? Homicidal ideation coming back? Can’t remember what you had for lunch? Promise not to drive over the speed limit?

    You know there’ll be a catch.

  32. ColoradoKid Says:

    Pedro – 23

    Ever since Political Correctedness came into vogue its considered undignified to mandate what foods someone on Food Stamps may or may not purchase with them … to which I say …. bullfeathers …. if its my damn money ( my as in Tax payers ) I’ve got every right in the world to say ” No Junk Food for You ” .. on my dime that is !!!!!!!

    So here’s the 21st century version of the children’s rhyme ” This Little Piggy ”

    This little piggy ate a ton of roast beef
    This little piggy even more
    This little piggy drank three Big Gulps
    This little piggy drank four

    And this little piggy ….. went wee wee wee .. all the way to the Cardiac Unit of his local hospital …. and died ….. costing the American tax payer on average $50K + .. per episode …..

    Moral of the story ? Don’t be ‘ this ‘ little piggy

    (Kit – I decided a little bluntness was in order after all … thanks for getting the ball rolling )

  33. K Benakole Says:

    ColoradoKid? What? I read your comment on the BMW Pininfarina Gran Lusso! Hey, did you look at the car at all? Everyone I’ve shown that car including car designers, budding and thriving and professionals, thinks it one of, if not, the best full-size coupe ever! My only problem with it being its V12 choice of engine! Anytime I see the V12 badge on cars my stomach gets a sharp bite! I hate it!

  34. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I had the two door version of the Corsica, a Beretta for a couple years, and I remember the dash moving around more than on most cars when going over bumps. Surprisingly, it didn’t audibly rattle as much as would have been expected.

    I don’t remember it riding rough, but I probably had low standards at the time. The Beretta replaced a first generation J car.

  35. T. Bejma Says:


    Fair enough…

    Hold on to your hats folks!! I have to agree with CK on this one (twice in one year, will wonders never cease). Good article. Agree with 75% of it. As I have always said, we still have some work to do, but heading in the right direction…

    Also, have to point out that I don’t think CK has EVER said that things at GM are ‘better’ until today (don’t make me go back and pull quotes that imply something like “GM back to their old tricks”, “GM will be gone within 5 years”, “GM does not deserve to exist”, etc., etc.,) ;-)

  36. T. Bejma Says:


    Levin needs to cut a few lb.’s of his own if he is going to get on us about our BMI ;-)

    [It's okay, I can knock him because he is a fellow Michigander!]

  37. ColoradoKid Says:

    33- T Bejma … you’re not ‘ remembering ‘ much of anything of late . I’ve been saying things are ‘ better ‘ at GM since the TJ days .. just no where’s near good enough … even said point blank the ATS at $35K as a Chevy would be the best car and especially the best Chevy ever made .. albeit as a $45k Cadillac its …. OK … pay attention …. and do something ’bout that memory son . You’re much too young to be forgetting things this easily

    PS – Don’t take my statements from the past out of context in order to try and prove your point . Thats your minders MO ….


    CK’s Moment of Eye Candy

    24 minutes of Lamborghini V12 history … including the AudiGhini era … unfortunately … enjoy !

  38. pedro fernandez Says:

    #30 5’7 no meds no smoke no drink no hanky panky no suicide thoughts but have thoughts of homicide when a$$hole cuts me off and then slams on brake to make a turn almost causing me to rear end him/her. Come on Ck, the Impala is the best Chevy in a very long time. Fair is fair!!!

  39. pedro fernandez Says:

    Kit this Corsica had the “Sports” package, I believe, stiffer suspension, larger wheels but no steering feel and sloppy handling for a “sporty” version, solid rear axle did not help matters.

  40. ColoradoKid Says:

    36 ….

    As far as the Impala ? Its …. well … the styling’s dull as cardboard and a Toyota/Hyudai/Nissan pastiche …. assuming they knocked about $5k off the price it might be OK …. otherwise its just another in a very long line of Camry wanna be’s … that aren’t .e.g. Much like the ATS … its not quite ready for prime time in its segment either

  41. pedro fernandez Says:

    The previous Impala was one of these cars that if you got it at the rental lot, you felt that you had just picked the smelly chick to take to the prom, the new one is like the Prom Queen by comparison.

  42. Kit Gerhart Says:

    From what I’ve seen, and read, the new Impala is a very nice car. The Impala is not a “Camry wannabe.” It is the next size up, competing with Avalon, and is a very good entry.

    Like a lot of cars, it can get expensive, but it doesn’t have to. Even if you want the V6, it is barely over $30, very well equipped.

  43. HtG Says:

    I repeat, do not watch this Chris Harris video, CK. No good can come of it. At one point, Monkey says, ‘there is no substitute.’ And then he goes and says it again!

    ‘He said it again!’

  44. HtG Says:

    Impala is magnificent. Yes it is

  45. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I’d kind of forgotten, but back in the 80′s, LTZ was the “sport” package. Now, it is the top trim level for most Chevy, emphasizing “luxury,” not sport.

  46. Brett Says:

    I recall Robert Cumberford writing that the Beretta was “the most perfectly styled and atrociously engineered vehicle GM ever produced.”

    I have to say it was a darned good looking coupé.

    Do you still have to wedge the A/C vents in place with folded business cards after the 1st year of ownership in GM cars? I’ve not kept track of that… :)

  47. T. Bejma Says:


    Just a couple from the CK file…

    “First you need to have the product . Then you actually have to have a few real geniuses on hand which from what I’ve seen lately from corporate right down to the sales floor GM does not have”

    “GM/Akerson/Lutz …. a big fat resounding and screaming like a mad man in an abandoned asylum ….. ZERO !”

    “I’m just sayin is all .. GM having more ‘ excuses ‘ than valid ‘ reasons’ of late … along with a constant stream of BS …. not to mention their plethora of Affirming an Denying the same thing at the same time …. along with their persistent self contradictions .”

    “Fact is … it only confirms what most people already suspect when it comes to GM .. That being GM’s over riding culture / Modus Operandi to this day … is to deny the obvious and hide behind a wall of rhetoric , insults and lies”

    “GM has become the master of ” Spin Doctor ” as well as ” Smoke & Mirrors ” .. with zero Style or Substance to back it up”

    “Same GM . Different Day . Same old result”

    Sure doesn’t present an air of “things are getting better at GM”… ;-)

  48. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #46, Brett asks:
    “Do you still have to wedge the A/C vents in place with folded business cards after the 1st year of ownership in GM cars? I’ve not kept track of that… ”

    My most recent GM car was a 2005 Malibu Maxx. The vents stayed in place, and it was a very good car. The reason I traded it was that I tend to get new cars about every five years. Yes, that is really silly. I replaced it with a Prius, because the Prius has plenty of space, and uses half as much gas, overall, in my mixed driving.

  49. W L Simpson Says:

    Reminiscing—–Detroit ! we build America’s cars! !

  50. ColoradoKid Says:

    T Bejma

    Anyone ever told you when it comes to conflict resolution , you’re the type of person that handed a BandAid would turn it into a club ?

    Anyone ever told you taking a quote out of its original context including the original conversation it came out of is the behavior expected of a 10 year old child ?

    Anyone ever told you dredging up the past in order to discredit someone who’s gotten your number time and time again is an act of abject futility ? Not to mention the very definition of an Internet Troll ?

    Anyone ever told you you’re more than a bit of a sore loser along with a healthy bit of an @$& ?

    Oh ,,,, but wait …. why am I bothering ? …. you’re just expressing all that is wrong with GM in one single post …

    Not exactly the way to go about promoting the brand there T Bejma . Especially when it comes to the likes of myself …. who ….. VOTE WITH THEIR CHECKBOOKS

    Yeah ….. you’d be brilliant in GM marketing ….. driving away what customers the company’s got left and losing the chance to gain any new ones

    Keep up the good work Bejma ! You’ll have GM begging at Congress’s door once again for bailouts … single handed !


  51. pedro fernandez Says:

    #46 I had forgotten that little detail, possibly from the up/down movement of the dash, we had a dancing Hawaiian doll on top of the dash and she developed a brain aneurism due to the shaking!

  52. HtG Says:


    I’d like to have heard more about hybrid materials, John, from Autoline. Mixing plastic and metals to make structural pieces sounds really cool.

  53. cwolf Says:

    I got a good look at the new Impala and like it even better up close. I have to drive this one and bet it’s sales will have an impact on the Taurus. Wonderful car, indeed!
    An ol’leatherneck gave me a sign in his shop before he passed away which read,”old age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill.” I now realize this is not always true as I have observed the barbs between T. Bejma and CK. Tom boy is trumping CK at every turn! Don’t ya just hate it when past comments bite you in the a$$ and facts and figures cannot be argued with beliefs and biased/credible sources?

  54. cwolf Says:

    Bad mouthing brands from the Detroit3 and the others in the US is not uncommon when convienent; loans, recalls and such. But is there much difference in the end result when the German brands in Europe knowingly under estimate their emissions and mpgs by 25% and are allowed to get away with such deceptions? I guess when one has deep pockets and buy into this “German engineered” crap, stupid is what stupid does!!

  55. Kate McLeod Says:

    Just what we need–wood in a car that comes from a petrified forest. It’s gorgeous though, that Gran Lusso Coupe.

  56. cwolf Says:

    Kate, they had to use wood thousand or so years old. The newer stuff had worm holes in it, if’n you remember! And just the thought of having a part of history on the dash will will make those who buy a Gran Lusso forget they just paid 200K euros for a BMW! I wonder how thick that veneer is?

  57. vrmchris Says:

    hello to all.

    chrysler and the uaw. should it have been any real surprise that the gentleman that was fired for expressing his views would be hired back into the company? this is still the united states of america. the gentleman simply expressed his view of the situation. which is his right to do. and should be able to do without jeapordizing his job.

    dodge avenger no longer being made. if one really thinks about it, while one can question the decision in the short term; long term it makes sense. the dart has had its best month in april, and if there is to be a new avenger; it will have to be priced above the dart. which will give the dart a real chance to sell between 15,000 and 20,000 units per month.

    bmw/pininfarina gran lusso coupe. imho a breath of fresh air. bmw needs to return to balance, proportion, and elegance in their style. former director of styling chris bangle had the right idea at the time for bmw. which resulted in bmw being distinctive (one can question the esthetics, however one cannot question the resulting raising of bmw’s profile nor the profits). however, now is the time for bmw to have cleaner styling outside and inside as well. however 5000 customers paying 200,000 euros each? if done as is, perhaps. if the specification of the concept is downgraded, no.

    honda and their walking assisting device. good for honda. now if they can have that charge last more than 60 minutes, even better.

    new sierra denali. yes, it is evolutionary in design. the silverado, not so much. given the space that denali competes in for gmc, the cash register will be ringing once again. i sense that the silverado will be in for a mid-cycle refresh before the sierra. and be more extensive in such.

    lightweight materials in automobiles. there are those who comment daily on this forum (coloradokid) who criticize those such as mclaren for using carbon fibre in their monocoque. however, where are the critical comments for ferrari for its laferrari? or porsche for its upcoming 918? both of them are using carbon fibre for their monocoques. yes, carbon fibre is unknown for long-term use as the main element in a monocoque or a unibody structure. we shall see indeed.

    ford closing manufacturing in australia. no surprise there. still disappointed that the falcon after manufacturing started in the 60s was never engineered for lhd for export. perhaps had ford realized that they should have done so, they may have not had to make said decision. for years, car enthusiasts have said that the falcon should have been exported to other parts of the world (especially north america) and return the platform with the mustang here in north america as the basis for both vehicles (yes, originally the falcon and the mustang were the same underneath).

    t. bejma and coloradokid. the bias (negative) that the kid has toward the domestics has become imho rather sad indeed. and his love of teutonia reminds me of hyundai smoke. which makes anything he says about every other marque lack credibility because of sheer hatred. i started reading this thread because it seemed to have a high level of comment and maturity. now, no longer is the commentary as a whole have things i can learn from. has it come to getting personal between various individuals? i have received that from some on here for no apparent reason. especially after apologizing and clarifying my position. and being polite. some of us were taught to do so. and i do not apologize for being so. coloradokid, you do have intelligence. there is no need to be personal with someone just they disagree with what you are saying. it is just that, a disagreement. i have to agree with cwolf. mr. t. bejma brought up what you have said in the past and mr. coloradokid you fell right into the ditch.

    i just hope that there can be some level of civility in the future. and others that listen to autoline daily can comment besides the usual suspects. this should be a great forum for discussion and comment. not what it has become as of 29 may 2013.

    mr. john mcelroy, thank you for the opportunity once again to provide information to car/driving enthusiasts. and to comment as well.


  58. vrmchris Says:


    there is no need to be personal with someone just because they disagree with you.


  59. RonE Says:

    #51,…a dancing Hawaiian doll on top of the dash and she developed a brain aneurism due to the shaking!

    Very good Pedro! That will keep me smiling the rest of the evening.

  60. cwolf Says:

    Wow! CR’s initial reports are rather positive towards the Impala….a US car!!

    I can hear it coming since the Impala shares the same platform as the Malibu and the XTS. So what will it be this time: the Impala an overpriced Malibu or the XTS is nothing more than an Impala with window dressing? I know! How about accepting the Impala as an Impala?

  61. G.A.Branigan Says:

    I can’t speak about the possible quality in fords or chrysler products,but I can,(and do) speak about the quality of my last two GM products.And I do so proudly.As most of you know I’m sick and tired of the anti-American bashing in all aspects,not just our American brands.Maybe not all of our vehicles are ‘top quality’ but they are improving,and many have improved in all aspects.Up to a par with top german stuff? I think on a dollar for dollar comparison,probably just as good in some respects,and even better in other respects.I don’t see anything wrong in a bit of national pride in what we have here,instead of scorn.

  62. Victor West Says:

    As to the new Impala – the TV ad they are running, I am older than dirt and my son says the ad is for people older than me. A loser ad?

  63. Brett Says:

    Let me just state that I have always rooted for GM. Their cars from the 60s were terrific, but, like Ford, not particularly in the 70s, and 80s.

    Their Spark, Sonic, Cruze, Malibu, Impala all seem to be terrific and I’m glad to see it, but they frustrated the Hell out of me of over 30 years with c**p that was designed and built to be fallen in love with on the showroom floor, driven for three or four years and then foisted off on some poor fool when the warranty was up.

    I’ve worked on the different brands and I can tell when something has been engineered to be quickly and cheaply assembled without regard for future repairs and one that has considered that eventuality. My wife’s 1983 Z-28 was abysmal in that regard. Our 1990 Mitsubishi has been fairly decent, and in comparison to that Camaro, downright wonderful to work on.

    I *know* that GMs stylists and engineers are some of the best in the world. I just like to see them allowed to do their best.

  64. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I just checked out the ad, and yeah, it does seem to be aimed at “old people” like myself. I think it’s a good ad, though, and, realistically, isn’t it “old people” that buy cars like Avalon and Taurus, the ones that Impala competes with?

    I’m sure Chevy would like to sell the car to younger people, but young people don’t buy large numbers of any cars in the Impala’s market segment.

  65. HtG Says:

    this ad?

    If so, wowie am I old at heart. I’m reading MadMen references and female wishes.

  66. ColoradoKid Says:

    ” Tom boy is trumping CK at every turn ”

    Really … on what planet cwolf ?

    Planet GM Delusional ?

    My old posts biting me ? I hardly think so . Those were honest opinions expressed in a specific content about a particular conversation . Taken out of context cwolf I could make you appear to be a card carrying communist in a heart beat .

    And don’t you …. a Tax Payer …. even for a moment wonder why it is with the Billions GM still owes us that their supposed employee … T Bejma is able to waste hours trawling this site to pick and chose bits and pieces of my former posts in his pathetic and vain attempt to discredit me ?

    And for what purpose pray tell ? To advance the cause of a company who in reality couldn’t give a rats ____ about him .. their customers … and especially you and I .

    That thought never crossed your mind ?

    Start applying some of those critical thinking skills I assume you have rather than taking the Blind Loyalty route there cwolf . And speaking of loyalty .. thanks for showing your cards as far as I’m concerned .

    Next time you’re wanting some financial advice you can just guess what finger I’m hiding behind my hand

  67. ColoradoKid Says:

    HtG – Phew …. a question ….

    The NJ F1 race . Whats the happs with that ? Nothing in the F1 media to be seen … but Ron Howard’s saying its a done deal .

    Any news on the home front thats not making it nationally ?

    BTW mein freund …. a little back up and support now and again would be welcome

  68. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Yep, that ad. It is about the 70-some couple I know who bought a Taurus a couple years ago, and might buy an Impala if shopping now.

  69. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The “tax payers,” including this one, got our money’s worth many times over with the rescue of GM and Chrysler. Only haters and idealogues say otherwise.

  70. ColoradoKid Says:

    And to G.A. Branigan . Take one last bit of advice from me … if you’ve the fortitude to do so and can drop your blind prejudice against Japanese products for but a minute …

    Buy a Toyota …. be it a Pick Up .. SUV what ever ….. and find out for yourself what the words QUALITY & Reliability really means . Cause those GM’s n’ JEEPs aint even in the same league …. guaranteed .

    Funny thing about those GM trucks . Whereas serious Overlanders and off roader will take a JEEP and rebuild it so’s to overcome those manufacturing weaknesses ….. no one serious even goes near a GM truck … Fords ? Yes . GM and Chrysler ? Not a chance .

    But hey . What do I know ? Listen to T Bejma . He know everything and GM’s a wonderfully successful company … yeah … thats why they still owe us in excess of $20 billion dollars in bail out money …. cause the company’s so successful and they make such great products .

    Tell yourself that enough and some day …. in the far too distant future it might just come true …. Who knows ?

    So G.A. … may I now assume you’ll be banging on Ben’s door about me as well ? Be my guest … remove me and take every bit of GM propaganda T Bejma drops on you as gospel fact.

  71. HtG Says:

    There’s this

    support; I don’t always feel competent to get in a dispute, CK, and other times I chose to be oblique out of respect for you.

  72. ColoradoKid Says:

    69 – No … only the GM delusional or the uninformed with little or no understanding of the financial FACTs and don’t pay enough taxes to really matter believe they got anywhere’s near their moneys worth . Especially those who worked for GM and are part and parcel of the whole GM mindset/culture and who’s pensions were saved in part by those bailouts ;-)

    Yeah you have no alterior motives or agenda now do you Kit ?

    Fact is …. YOU may of benefitted personally Kit . But the rest of us got screwed … and in fact still are … every time a VOLT is sold … every day that $20+ billion is owed … every percentage of interest lost …. etc

  73. ColoradoKid Says:

    HtG – 71- I don’t pretend to understand but I’ll respect your decision in the matter …. and assuming I go down in a ball of flames over this cause I’m in no mood having seen what my 2013 tax bill’s looking like to take any crap from the GM blindly faithful … do feel free to hit me up ‘cross the pond …. as I’ve enjoyed our conversations

    And hopefully …. see ya at the Joisey GP ? Where all … or at least most …. can be revealed ….

  74. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Thanks for that link. Unfortunately, it seems to not look good for the NJ race.

  75. G.A.Branigan Says:

    @ CK: I’ve been buying and using 4×4 pickup trucks most of my adult life.I know what I like,I know what works for me.I don’t need you or anybody else telling me anything about them.I read,I do my due diligence and know exactly what my 4×4 needs are and buy accordingly.

    Toyota: The tundra is a joke of a truck and is outdated and not as capable as others.I don’t give a damn what your friends drive or use.As for the taco,that is damn near an antique in automotive terms and is all but useless.The new GM’s/Rams/Ford 1/2 tons are far more capable and consume less fuel then the new-old taco.

    Jeeps……pure junk,no argument.

    I’m in my 60′s CK.I have been buying my own vehicles since I was 16 years old.Although I know I’m not an expert,I have been around and know what I like,and what I don’t.”Blind prejudice”? You do know that is a two way street…right? You don’t think I know quality when I see it? I know that chevies are far beneath you,but your blind prejudice shines as brightly as mine.

  76. ColoradoKid Says:

    Kit – So what ? No rebuttal ? No defense of your self serving opinions ? No attempt on your part to defend the indefensible ? No cute little quips or phrases in support of your agenda based opinions ?

    Gee Kit .. I’m so disappointed …

  77. HtG Says:


    If the organizers can figure out a way to unlock the value in all that real-estate, maybe they can pay the F1 fee. If it’s a ten year deal Bernie needs, then that’s between $250-500M, which doesn’t sound like a lot considering all the moolah in the neighborhood. It’s really tough to compete against governments who want to use the sport for promotion. I wish we still had Imola, but it ain’t.

  78. Kit Gerhart Says:

    My Delphi pension would have been the same, with or without the bailout, but….My investment, much less so.

    GM shutting down would have sent the entire auto industry into a depression. Suppliers to other companies would have shut down. All of those newly orphaned GM vehicles would have suffered extraordinary depreciation, putting owners farther upside down on loans, so guess what? Those people wouldn’t be buying new cars from anyone. They’d be forced to keep what they have.

  79. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Reading and posting here isn’t my entire life. I was doing something else for a few minutes, if you can imagine that.

  80. ColoradoKid Says:

    75 – You keep on believing that …. and someday …. in a far away land …. it may even be true …. but here on planet earth … you’ve allowed what ever’s motivated your anti Japanese stance to severely color your opinions

    And btw …. age 57 …. and I BUILT my first car at age 16 …. a GM in fact .. 65 Olds F85 w/69 442 455 in the snout … balanced .. blue printed … etc …. and as a reminder ….. I was a staunch supporter of the only car GM makes that was worth a damn …. the C6

    My so called GM prejudice is based on years of experience and fact . Whats your anti Japanese cars attitudes based on pray tell ? Certainly not any FACT’s I can find …. amongst the press … the pros … and the people who’s lives most often depend on them

    So back at ya big fella !

  81. ColoradoKid Says:

    78 – And like I’ve said a 1000 times …. perhaps … maybe GM should of been bailed out ….. but with a hell of a lot more restrictions etc than either GWB or ObamaClaus placed on those bailouts ( re; FDR’s approach to the depression …. half the reason we were so well prepared for WWII was because of the disciplines imposed by the WPA etc .. ) …. whereas Chrysler should of been left to rot

    And yes … those bailouts may of delayed the inevitable …. but how bad do you think it’ll be now if it all comes crashing down anyway ? Which … if you’re following the World economy … you know is a possibility

  82. Kit Gerhart Says:

    It looks like the new Impalas are selling well. The local dealer sold their last one, and doesn’t have any in stock.

  83. ColoradoKid Says:

    And as to the entire auto industry gone into a depression had the bailouts not been instituted

    Each and every economic pundit on both sides of the fence as well a 85% of the auto industry Business pundits ( notice I did qualify that as BUSINESS pundits as in those who comprehend the complexities of BUSINESS … not those who simply follow it ) agree …. had the bailouts not happened …. for a period of perhaps 5 years there would of been fallout … but in the end many others would have filled the gap …. and things would of been just fine .

    BWTM – Had Chrysler been left to rot ….. GM and Ford would be in a much stronger position … rather than the tenuous financial predicament they both find themselves in today

  84. T. Bejma Says:


    And the Billions of “your” taxes that may be lost in the bailout would have turned into 100′s of Billions when every single GM and Chrysler pension would have been handed over to the (already very broke – as in severely under water) PBGC…

    Oh, I guess I do know a little bit about BUSINESS…

  85. Kit Gerhart Says:

    So we would have had 15-20% unemployment for only 5 years. That doesn’t sound too good to me.

  86. Brett Says:


    Well, it would’ve only hurt the “little people” and who cares about them? Right? :)

  87. Kit Gerhart Says: