AD #2233 – Infiniti Reveals New QX80, German Collusion Could Be Costly, Will BEVs Really Catch On?

November 14th, 2017 at 11:46am

Runtime: 6:56

0:30 Hail Atlantis!
0:51 Don’t Buy, Share
1:20 Will BEVs Really Catch On?
2:50 The Book Cadillac
3:23 German Collusion Could Be Costly
4:45 Heavy Truck Sales Soar
5:21 New Infiniti QX80

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29 Comments to “AD #2233 – Infiniti Reveals New QX80, German Collusion Could Be Costly, Will BEVs Really Catch On?”

  1. David Sprowl Says:

    Clearly BOOK has a limited market at that price. As for BEVs beating hybrids, BEVs’ offer a distinct advantage was far as maintenance goes. No oil change and other items related to ICE. That puts hybrids at a distinct disadvantage. Having said that “ecomonics rules the purchase world” Until there are charging stations that can charge the same rate as a petro fill and everywhere gas stations are now, that will be the drawback along with battery cost.

  2. Bob Gurr Says:

    BEVs? It will be a long time. Reality suggests all is moot until an EV can be built with a profit independently of any government incentive AND can be priced equal to any segment ICE.

  3. Phil Says:

    I likely wouldn’t consider a BEV mainly because of the charging expense at home (there’s no free lunch!) and the lack of fast charging accessible stations in the field.
    A Hybrid is an option but to my knowledge, there aren’t any “reasonable” sporty cars, i.e. Camaro, Mustang that offer a Hybrid version. Then, there’s the performance aspect. While not a “pedal to the metal” type, the hybrids I’ve driven have good initial acceleration but once their rolling they seem to lose their “bluster”. Then, there’s the black hole of the problems with the batteries and the electric portion in general…

  4. XA351GT Says:

    Call me a dinosaur ,but I’m not ride sharing. I like owning my own equipment. Having rented equipment I know that many times to get left with crap that doesn’t work like it should and waste your time trying to either replace it or get it to work .Also knowing that people tend to not treat stuff they don’t own very well( hell many beat the tar own stuff) I don’t want to follow behind someone else.

  5. Kit Gerhart Says:

    As long as gas is dirt cheap in the U.S., relatively speaking, hybrids won’t sell in huge numbers. If gas were $6 a gallon, there would be a lot more hybrids sold, and a lot fewer huge SUV’s and pickups.

    As far as pure electrics, they will remain primarily commuter cars, for the foreseeable future. It they had quick change batteries, or if there were as many charge stations as gas stations, and batteries could be charged in 5 minutes, EV’s would be practical highway vehicles, but as things are now, they are not. Even a Tesla S is highly compromised as a long distance highway car, compared to gas burners.

    As I’ve mentioned before, I like plug-in hybrids as “do everything” cars with low operating cost, but I don’t have a place to plug one in, so it wouldn’t work for me.

    All of this assumes battery costs will continue to come down, making plug-in cars price competitive, or nearly so.

  6. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #3 Rumor has it, that Ford will sell a hybrid Mustang. That should be interesting.

  7. Lambo2015 Says:

    BEVs still face 2 main challenges. 1)Battery life which could lend a 8-10 year old car needing a 5-10k battery.
    2)EVs still have range limitations even if a charging structure is put in place. People will not want to wait any longer to fill up than it takes to fill a tank of gas.

    Sorry David but I disagree with the advantage of service/maintenance of an EV. Most cars today need very little beyond oil changes for 100k miles. Most are now at 10k intervals now too so 10 oil changes at $50 is far cheaper than buying a new battery. Imagine if a manufacturer produced a ICE vehicle that required a new powertrain after 10 years regardless of mileage.

    EVs will be a big hit for those that have a second car for trips. They don’t plant to keep beyond 5-7 years and typically live in a house or housing that provides charging stations. IMO

  8. Jim Bielecki Says:

    As for BEV vehicles catching on, maybe it will depend on where you live. In metropolitan areas, this may happen, but in rural areas, like where I live, I just don’t see a wholesale change to a BEV happening anytime soon. Range anxiety, charging times, and poor battery performance in cold weather (zero degrees F and colder) will give an ICE powered vehicle an advantage for a long time.

  9. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #7 Yep, oil change intervals are once a year or 10K miles for a Prius, and probably most other Toyotas. It’s once a year or 15K miles for a MINI. The Corvette has a “count down,” that ends up saying about 7K miles.

  10. Don B. Says:

    I admit I don’t know about diesel urea injection but the size of the reservoir should not change the function of the chemical. Having a small tank will make you stop at the dealer more , which could be considered a scam to get more service work. If the euro cars continue to operate with an empty “blue” tank, then it’s the euro government’s fault for allowing it.

  11. Danny Turnpaugh Says:

    The more hybrids on the road, the more gas for the truck loving people.

  12. Drew Says:

    The main advantages of a BEV over a hybridare package efficiency, torque, and handling (low Cd). The advantages of a hybrid over a. eV have already been stated – range and economics.

  13. Chuck Grenci Says:

    Right on Don B. #9, the size of the tank only makes fill-ups more frequent. Urea is available at a lot of automotive stores, even Walmart and other retail outlets. This is not rocket science, you just add to the urea tank. If the Europeans want some sort of lock-out if the tank is empty, that’s one thing, fining the automakers billions just sounds as they are dipping into profits for their own interests (elsewhere). Collusion, I’m not so sure, co-operation so all makers are playing on the same field, more likely. Just an opinion (and I will yield if I’m wrong)

  14. Buzzerd Says:

    Ad Blue- in further reading it is alleged that because of the manufactures agreeing on limiting tank size that emissions aren’t being cleaned as much as they could with out increasing the amount of times you would have to refill the fluid to a point that people maybe wouldn’t tolerate. Seems like a bit of a stretch but either way they were colluding. Imagine that – a german car company colluding on emission cheating!
    Say it isn’t so…

  15. G.A.Branigan Says:

    I don’t know how the add blu system works on the eu diesels,but here if you run out of def,the nanny puts you into limp home mode. I don’t see much of a difference if the tank is 2 gallons or 20. When it needs to be filled up,you fill it up,period.

  16. Albemarle Says:

    The sole advantage for hybrids is fuel economy. You are right John, that’s not enough. If I remember, Lincoln was selling MKX in both regular and hybrid trim for the same price and still people preferred the regular version.
    EVs are a totally different kettle of fish. Perky, fun, and economical (once purchased). Costs about 1/3 to fill up on electricity at home as buy gas. But, most will not go to one car families. Ideal as a second car, they are most practical when you recharge only at home. For me, with the Bolt, it’s not range anxiety, it’s that I don’t want to spend that time searching for an available charger and then waiting for the charge.
    Years ago we had a propane van. Economical but a real pain to find a refuelling station. No thanks.

  17. Dave Thompson Says:

    Hybrids also tend to last longer especially in a taxi situation

  18. John McElroy Says:

    #6. The hybrid Mustang is not a rumor. Ford publicly announced it will do it. And they promise it’s going to have terrific performance.

  19. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #16 Thanks for info, John.

    I hope they use a system similar to the usual Toyota/Ford system, only scaled up to 300 hp or so. It would have smooth, seamless power, like a Prius or Fusion hybrid, only a lot more power. I suspect I’d like it.

  20. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #14 Was there ever an MKX hybrid? There was an MKZ hybrid, for the same price as the V6. The hybrid used half as much gas, but the V6 was peppier.

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #14 A friend had a propane pickup truck years ago, and he filled it only at home, and drove something else if going very far. It was a Ford with the 300 cid six and, as I remember, it had only about 100 mile range with the tank in the front of the box.

  22. Ziggy Says:

    When you mention the heavy truck sales would it be possible to list out the details like you do with the auto companies, we see the heavy trucks on the road everyday we commute and I think it would be interesting to know which companies do best. Thanks.

  23. Bob Wilson Says:

    Called a “garage hybrid,” BEV owners often have a second car. Worse, BEVs are seldom driven to their range limit. In contrast, a plug-in hybrid fires up the engine and completes the trip. This also works in reverse.

    Gas gauges are notoriously imprecise. When doing a cross-country trip, the battery provides an accurate, 20-50 mile reserve which is enough to reach a 24×7 gas station or a safe place to park.

    Our plug-in hybrids cost less than half than gas around town, ~90% of our miles. For the remaining 10% vacations and trips, we get 40-56 MPG which is quite affordable. As for the other, 98% market buyers, we don’t expect them to pay us the fuel bill difference.

    Bob Wilson, Huntsville, AL

  24. Chuck Grenci Says:

    Even if the German car companies colluded in the size of the urea tank (I’d call it cooperating so no one could claim range advantage), as said, some form of limp mode could be initiated to require the tank to be filled (even if more often). Urea, at least in the States is easily assessable and quite inexpensive, so I don’t see the problem. And certainly, billions in fine; I find that excessive, and perhaps the governments involved, colluded (if seeking such a high payout). A spare bottle of urea could be stashed in the trunk/boot/storage compartment for such occurrences and I would think (but don’t know for sure) whether there is a urea-low-level warning seen on the dash.

  25. Anthony Parisio Says:

    Today’s hybrids are slow and ugly. Electrics like Tesla are faster and far superior to any gas car. As Cd replaced Vinyl because of superiority so shall electric replace ICE. Superiority at price parity is a no brainer.

  26. Anthony Parisio Says:

    John you should try living with a Tesla for a week. With only 50 AMP charging at home, 100 KW battery and supercharger on the highways there is never any range anxiety. It is a far easier and more carefree experience than a fossil car. A test drive is not like living with the car. A properly done electric such as a Tesla is just a joy with which to live.

  27. Lambo2015 Says:

    I think part of the range anxiety with a pure EV comes from the fact that charging stations are limited and unlike gas if you do run it dry you can walk to the nearest station and carry a gas can with a few gallons to get you home.

  28. Kit Gerhart Says:

    #23 A Prius is faster than a 1960′s Ford, Chevy, or Plymouth with the base V8, about 10 seconds 0-60. A Fusion hybrid is a little quicker. That is plenty “fast enough” for normal driving. For “modern” comparison, a Ford Escape is only 0.2 seconds quicker 0-60 than the Prius, and tied in the quarter mile (CR tests; they do automatics the same way, just floor it).

    As far as “ugly,” that is in the eye of the beholder. I understand some people considering Priuses to be ugly, but it would take rather unusual aesthetics to consider today’s Fusion ugly.

  29. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Even with a Tesla, you have to “pick your routes” when on a long trip, and make more frequent, and longer stops to “fuel up.” A Tesla would be a great commuter car, if you have a place to plug in at home, and want to spend that much money on the car. As a “do everything” car, it doesn’t compete, at least not yet.