AD #2454 – Tesla Scolded Over Safety Claims, 4-Cylinder Silverado Details, BMW Takes Controlling Stake in China JV

October 11th, 2018 at 11:35am

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Runtime: 6:26

0:32 VW Makes Management Changes
1:03 NHTSA Scolds Tesla Over Safety Claims
2:14 All-New 4-Cylinder Silverado Details
3:04 Jaguar I-PACE Sounds Like It’s from Space
4:20 BMW Takes Controlling Stake in China JV
5:02 Ford’s Intersection Priority Management

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36 Comments to “AD #2454 – Tesla Scolded Over Safety Claims, 4-Cylinder Silverado Details, BMW Takes Controlling Stake in China JV”

  1. Larry D. Says:

    I am no expert on pickups, but sacrificing the v8 and even the 6 to get the coffeemaker 4 cylinder should come with some decent MPG numbers. 21 is laughably small. Diesels get 30 MPG on full size pickups. They are the way to go, not lame 4s stretched to their limits and therefore possibly high maintenance and repair.

    as for the Jag SUVs, their interiors are a MAJOR disappointment, to those used to the outstanding interiors of the XJ of Christmas past…

  2. Larry D. Says:

    As far as Ford’s silly “performance SUV”, I will skip the first half hour and listen to the serious part of AAH, after the guest and his free commercial are over.

    BTW, “Performance SUV” is an oxymoron, if the performance means handling, acceleration and the like. Performance for SUVs means off road capabilities and towing. But of course the Edge is not an SUV. It is not even a crossover, no matter what the Ford PR types call it. It is a well-disguised Minivan.

  3. MJB Says:

    I’m still trying to wrap my head around what effect would be made on traffic if stopping at read lights became a thing of the past. Would everyone’s cars slow considerably in anticipation of the upcoming light(s) changing to green?

    I think it’d take me some time to get used to that feeling of not going as fast as I think I should be…

    I suppose a precursor to that might be the roundabout. I love roundabouts, but even with those, there’s sometimes a need to stop first.

  4. Vic Maslanka Says:

    Ford’s Intersection Priority – Never stop at a traffic signal again? I guess Ford is doing away with pedestrians.

  5. BobD Says:

    So BMW is investing $4.2 billion in China to expand production there so they don’t have to build their SUVs in the USA and export them to China to avoid new tariffs. I thought trade wars were easy to win????

  6. Chuck Grenci Says:

    I am glad and encouraged that the I-Pace is using sounds that vary in intensity and octave; this should more allow proper distinction from where a vehicle is coming or going. I believe all manufacturers should be required to emulate a similar varied sound. A steady drone sound can lose its identity by merging that sound into a background sound that might be interpreted as non-threatening and non-viable.

    I too thought that Chevrolet could have squeezed better highway mileage out of that four cylinder; after all with all that torque available it could surely power an overdriven final drive (ratio).

  7. Kit Gerhart Says:

    1 The 2019 Ram 3.6 mild hybrid gets 20/25 mpg city/highway. The 2018 Ram 1500 diesel get 20/27. The Silverado 5.3 V8 gets the same highway rating as the 4, but only 17 city. It seems that big turbo 4 in the Silverado is mainly for people who just like 4 cylinder engines.

    2 Minivans have sliding side doors. The Edge does not.

    3 I like roundabouts, but it seems that many Americans don’t know how to drive them, and stop when they don’t need to. People in London know how to drive them.

  8. Kit Gerhart Says:

    That big turbo 4 might be good in something lighter, like Equinox or Colorado. It might get decent highway mileage, with very tall gearing in a lighter, lower drag vehicle.

  9. Larry D. Says:

    7 I did say it is not just a Minivan in disguise, but that it is a “well disguised” minivan.
    Smaller minivans don’t always have sliding doors, Did the original MPV have them? The original, smaller Odyssey?
    and the Tesla X, which is really minivan proportioned, has gullwing doors.

    I remember a full sized diesel truck that got 30 MPG. Was it a Ford or Future Ford product?

    Interesting that last year’s Ram Diesel is better by 2 MPG HWY and EQUAL (!) in the city to the current Ram Mild Hybrid, which has a far more complex powerplant (two of them in fact, and the connecting hardware and software going back and forth). Why bother producing it? Is it cheaper than the 2018 Ram Diesel? (cheaper to make, for sure, but pricewise?)

  10. Larry D. Says:

    My highway exit has been replaced by a roundabout instead of a traffic light, and they put three more of them roundabouts down the road to my place, and while I like them, I am always cautious that the other drivers that are supposed to stop at the Yield sign for me to go, will not know or will not want to stop, so I waste time trying to figure out what they will do.

  11. Larry D. Says:

    The public accepts it when human drivers make mistakes, but will not accept it when an AV, also via some kind of human error, (design or construction or operation), kills another pedestrian. I strongly believe they really are not ready for prime time, and they will not resolve all their problems even ten years from now, if ever. The cheerleaders overlook many important issues, ethical ones, legal liability, who is responsible for that damage award, and the like. Plus so far AVs hav eoperated only under 100% “Rosy Scenarios”, perfect weather, visibility, etc.

  12. Kit Gerhart Says:

    9 OK, to me, minivans have sliding doors. I consider tall wagons with hinged doors to be tall wagons, or “MPVs” as they are called many places in the world. OK, Edge is a well disguised minivan, as is a Journey and some others tall wagons with hinged doors.

    Yeah, the first Odyssey had hinged doors. I didn’t really considerate a minivan, but that’s just me.

    I tried to find info on the upcoming F150 and Silverado “light duty” diesels, but they aren’t listed yet on the EPA site.

    The Ram diesel has an 8% better highway rating than the mild hybrid, but on 15% more expensive fuel. I’d expect the real world advantage of the diesel to be greater than the difference in EPA ratings, though. I suspect the diesel costs thousands more. I’ll see if I can find actual numbers.

    If the mild hybrid were a Toyota, I’d have no concern about the complexity, given the reliability of their serious hybrids, but with FCA, I wouldn’t want to be the first kid on the block to buy one.

  13. Kit Gerhart Says:

    9 The diesel does not show up in the “build and price” for the 2019 Ram 1500, so I can’t determine the price premium over the other engines. Also, only “crew cabs” are listed. I assume there will be other body styles available, but they are waiting to sell out the old ones.

  14. Buzzerd Says:

    I thought I’d heard Ram wasn’t going to sell the small diesel anymore. I know several people who have one and have had problems which has been the one of the down sides of diesels. A turbo 4 may be the better option.

  15. Lambo2015 Says:

    Chevy; With such little improvement in MPG I have no idea why they would even bother with the 4cyl offering. The money spent to develop/manufacture could have been better spent. I guess they can use it to offer super low lease deals as I dont see it being a big seller.

  16. Buzzerd Says:

    15 How much did Ford spend on the eco boom … er eco boost with similar results? Lesson here is – it’s tough to get mileage out of a 5,000 lb truck…. really tough.

  17. Kit Gerhart Says:

    14 Could be. The diesel isn’t list on the EPA site, while the V6, and the V8 with and without the mild hybrid setup are listed. So far, no 2019 Ford pickups are listed.

    The Ram V8 mild hybrid only ties the rating of the 5.3 Silverado, but the Ram is probably quicker.

  18. Lambo2015 Says:

    #9 The differences between the minivan and most similar size SUV/CUVs is hardly anything. What is the difference? Sliding doors, 3rd row, 4wd?
    No one really wants to be associated to the minivan but most of these SUVs are just minivans without sliding doors. Maybe sit a bit higher some without the third row and some with 4WD but that was also available on minivans. So to me the only significant difference is the sliding doors.
    I feel like the family sedan and minivan has morphed into the modern SUV. I honestly dont see the sedan as we know it lasting but in a very few offerings. Cars are evolving into this higher seated hatchback that is the SUV/CUV. As mobility services continue to grow and vehicles become more pieces of just transportation the more they will look alike and be more about function and not style. I’m sure most kids today would look at a 57 Chevy and wonder why it has wings. They would have no idea what to make of a Dagmar. Those items were about the fashion, style and the time-period.

  19. Kit Gerhart Says:

    15 Some people might actually like that engine. As with most of today’s turbos, it develops peak torque at low rpm, so the transmission will probably shift at low rpm in normal driving, something diesel lovers might like.

    I look forward to hearing impressions from road testers, and buyers, if anyone I know ends up buying one.

  20. Lambo2015 Says:

    #7 Good point Kit. What I would like to see is what is the MPG between the 4cyl and the V8 when both are towing 7500lbs.. My guess is the V8 will get better milage than the 4cyl when loaded.

  21. G.A.Branigan Says:

    @ Larry: GM will also offer an I6 turbo diesel for the 1500′s. Although I believe it will only be offered for the top trim lines = another dumb move by gm.

  22. Buzzerd Says:

    19- the people I know like the motor, well they did until it went into limp mode 4hours from home. Not fun having big rigs passing you going up hills. Again, that’s been the achenes heel of diesels, great until something breaks and then not so much. Gas engines suffer far far less from that.

  23. Kit Gerhart Says:

    18 Today’s “minivans” are huge, compared to most front drive based CUV’s, though the bigger CUV’s, like Traverse, are about the same size. The vans have more versatile seating/cargo arrangements, like Chrysler’s “stow and go,” unless there are some similar arrangements in CUVs I don’t know about. Also, except for Sienna, today’s vans are FWD only, and generally have lower ride height than CUVs/SUVs.

    As long as people don’t care about highway fuel economy, and don’t care about handling, beyond “adequate,” I agree that cars won’t make a come back any time soon. I’m doing my part to save them, but I’m old enough that I won’t be buying too many more.

  24. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20. Yep, probably right about the mpg under load, and the V8 would last a lot longer under those conditions.

  25. Lambo2015 Says:

    23 You could get 4WD on the Honda Odyssey, Dodge caravan, Nissan Quest, Kia Sedona, Chevy Uplander, Chrysler Pacifica, and AWD on the Toyota Sienna, Not sure which ones are still being made but I dont think thats a good indicator to determine if its a minivan or not.
    Yea the seating is more versatile but most SUV/CUVs have at a minimum fold down seating and not all minivans had stow and go so not a great indicator of vehicle class.

  26. Kit Gerhart Says:

    25 Odyssey, Caravan, Pacifica, and Sedona are now FWD only. Sienna is available with AWD. The earlier Pacifica was a much different vehicle than the current one, and had hinged doors. Quest and Uplander are extinct.

    OK, vehicle “classes” are in the eye of the beholder, except for the ways governments categorize them for various regulations. To me, a Mazda 5 was a minivan, and a Chevy Traverse is not. Others may feel differently.

  27. Bishop Says:

    @16 Ford’s 3.5L EB and 2.7L V6 EB have been very popular. It kinda all depends on what a person’s needs are when choosing a P/U power train.

    The F150 3.5L EB is rated at 13,200# towing and 3200# payload with 375HP and 470Ft# torque. That is 700# more towing than the Silverado’s 6.2L V8 and 2500# more than any Big Horn with the 5.7L Hemi and IIRC the Big Horn’s max payload is around 1800#. The Ram’s Eco-Diesel maxed out at 8090# and around 1450#.

    So if you need to be able to pull something (like a travel trailer or dump trailer, or even a car hauler) regularly, but don’t want (or need)to pay the premium to go up to a F-250 or 2500, and yet, you drive a lot (where mpg might become an issue), then it’s easy to see which way to go.

    As with any turbo’d vehicle, you have to know how to drive it – if you want good gas mileage. My son got 29.x mpg with his 3.5L EB F150 – when he kept it at the posted speed limit (60-65) on a trip in an area known for it speed traps.

    And yet, if you feel the need for speed (and have access to E50 fuel and a good tuner) then you can whomp up on unsuspecting straight-liners:

    BTW, the 2.7L 4-pot gets only 1 mpg better than I used to get with a ’99 F150 4.6L V8 SC LB with up to 800# in the box.

    I agree, it will be interesting to see how that one works out.

  28. Kit Gerhart Says:

    27 A friend bought a fairly basic F150 with the 2.7 turbo a couple years ago. He got that engine, because he liked the way it drove, even compared to the V8. He only gets in the low 20′s mpg on the interstate, but he drives fast, 75-80 where the speed limit is 70. In local, mixed driving, he gets in the mid teens.

    Like most pickup owners, he never tows anything, and rarely hauls anything, but has the truck to, occasionally, haul a motorcycle in the box.

  29. M Campbell Says:

    @27 ROTFLMAO! It is, in fact, SO “easy to see which way to go” that there is neither industry nor public consensus on which is the preferred platform!

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    29 I had to google it to find out what the ROTF meant. The “F” didn’t mean what I expected.

  31. Len simpson Says:

    Help ! how the heck do I turn off my IPace noise maker ? :)

  32. Len simpson Says:

  33. Terry Quinn Says:

    Ford didn’t invent the technology to eliminate traffic lights. Carnegie Mellon University was talking about that a year ago (maybe Ford uses their technology). The idea has been around for decades, but the CM idea of using V2V communications was new.

  34. Earl Says:

    GM has a big budget when it comes to developing engines.They have more engines than all their competitors.
    The take rate on that new 2.7L 4 cylinfder in a full size pickup will be low. Initially they’get every dealer to order a few and these will sit on the dealers lots and after about 9 months they’ll be putting money on the hood to sell them.
    I can see them detuning this 2.7 to put out less power and then have it available for the Colorado/Canyon. Perhaps they could see there way into a few SUV’s.

  35. Bob Wilson Says:

    Jalopnik (see link) shows how Tesla took the detailed metrics from all tested cars and used them to calculate a risk value. Normally this data lets manufacturers to tweak their designs to improve safety. Tesla reported the ranking of these engineering data.

    NHTSA tries to hide detailed safety data by rolling them up into the kindergarden star scale. It is treating customers as ‘too dumb’ to understand the details and Tesla called them out on it.

  36. Al C Says:

    Glad to see Nik takeoff his blinder glasses and used normal arms to drive. I believe these glasses should be banned for drivers.