AD #2794 – Ford Mustang Mach-E Winter Tests; Detroit Three Keep Plants Open; BMW To Cut Drivetrain Variants in Half

March 16th, 2020 at 11:49am

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Listen to “AD #2794 – Ford Mustang Mach-E Winter Tests; Detroit Three Keep Plants Open; BMW To Cut Drivetrain Variants in Half” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 8:02

0:07 Detroit Three Keep Plants Open
1:05 BMW Automatic Emission-Free City Driving
1:56 GM Merges Powertrain Ops into Product Development
3:05 VW Reveals ID.3 Pricing
3:51 Toyota Testing Blockchain Technology
4:24 Work Boots for Women
5:31 BMW To Cut Drivetrain Variants in Half
6:14 Ford Mustang Mach-E Winter Testing

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41 Comments to “AD #2794 – Ford Mustang Mach-E Winter Tests; Detroit Three Keep Plants Open; BMW To Cut Drivetrain Variants in Half”

  1. Lambo2015 Says:

    I might be blown away by how the Mach-e accelerates in the snow but equally important is how well does it stop? I’m guessing not any better than any other EV and due to its weight probably not as well as a lighter ICE vehicle of similar size.

  2. Buzzerd Says:

    GM offers 3 different gas engines for it’s Blazer, seems a bit much. Why would you do that to yourself as a manufacturer.

  3. GM Veteran Says:

    Agreed Lambo. Hopefully the Mach E will come with upgraded brakes, as all EVs with strong acceleration characteristics should. Otherwise, its like dropping a crate V8 into a 60s base car and leaving the drum brakes in place.

    The women’s work shoes are a great idea. Surprising it took so long for a company to come out with a line like this. I think a more stylish men’s line is also a great idea.

    OK, now switching to youtube to listen to the Eagles – Those Shoes!

  4. Kit Gerhart Says:

    2 In my younger days, about 8 different engines, and 3 different transmissions were offered in many cars. How could they do it in the ’60s, but we get almost no choice now, except with the Dodge Challenger?

    With the Blazer, the 3 engines are substantially different from each other. Unfortunately, there is only one available transmission.

  5. Buzzerd Says:

    4 but in those days the cars had grossly oversized engine bays that you cold practically fit 2 motors. Now, almost every aspect of a vehicle is optimized and also add in the fact that in the 60′s yea you had a bunch of choices of cars trannys but the other options were a fraction of what is available now.

  6. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Stupid name aside, the Mach-E could well be the most serious Tesla 3/Y competitor from a mainstream car company. I look forward to seeing the vehicle, and reading tests of the production version.

  7. Kit Gerhart Says:

    5 You mean the options now are a small fraction of what was available in the ’60s? In the ’60s, you had 15 or more paint color choices, 7 interior color choices, bench or buckets seats, with or without power steering and brakes, crank windows available, multiple final drive ratios available, and much more. Here is a list of options for a 1965 Chevelle. This is probably just for the base model, not Malibu SS, or others.

    https://www.chevellestuff.net/1965/options_by_model.htm

    and a color list.

    https://www.autocolorlibrary.com/pages/1965-Chevrolet.html#parentHorizontalTab1

  8. Kit Gerhart Says:

    5 You mean the options now are a small fraction of what was available in the ’60s? In the ’60s, you had 15 paint color choices, 7 interior color choices, bench or buckets seats, with or without power steering and brakes, crank windows available, multiple final drive ratios available, and much more. Here is a list of options for a 1965 Chevelle. This is probably just for the base model, not Malibu SS, or others.

    https://www.chevellestuff.net/1965/options_by_model.htm

  9. Kit Gerhart Says:

    and a color list.

    https://www.autocolorlibrary.com/pages/1965-Chevrolet.html#parentHorizontalTab1

  10. Buzzerd Says:

    Yea you had more colour choices but big deal, you are still only picking one colour unlike the endless combinations that can be had with power options. By that list there are really 2 engines, 6 or an 8 but different spec of 8. The new blazer has 3 engines. I don’t have a list of the power options but it’s very extensive. I believe there’s 3 levels of driver aids alone. 3 different sets of rims. Add in infotainment options, on your list there are a whole 3 options for the radio.

  11. Lambo2015 Says:

    8&10 Biggest difference is driven by emissions and the cost involved in certifying multiple powertrains combinations (engine transmission).
    Also with paint which is a huge expense to have multiple colors because many components are outsourced and need to match body color. Even with interiors one supplier might supply the seat and a different supplier does door panels and they need to match. So its much different than back in the 60s when most of these things were done in-house. So your options have switched over to things that are much easier to mix and match with little impact on noticeability.

  12. Lambo2015 Says:

    11 cont- Honestly how many engine combinations do you really need anymore? With small 4 cyl and 6 cyl engines producing as much and more HP than the V8s of the 60s the need to have multiple engines has been reduced. Manufacturers typically now only offer a base engine which is adequate a possible higher output version and sometimes a very small offering to advertise great MPG that is only good for inner city commuting.

  13. Fensterlips Says:

    OK, my memory isn’t what it used to be but I recall the mid-60’s with an Impala’s engine choices going from a straight 6, was it still the 235? To small block V8s starting with the 283, then 327 and the big blocks offering the 396 and 427. In 1970 those choices were still available but they added the new gen engines, the 305, 350 and 400 to the small blocks. The cars themselves came in framed and frameless windows, vinyl tops, convertibles, AC or no, crank or electric as well as electric seat options. There were at least 2 radios. The 2 doors came with or without a center console, bench or bucket and two roof lines one chopped tight and other a fastback look. I had a 69 Impala Custom which had the additional headlight doors. And then all the colors. I remember Cadillac had a canary yellow and a very orange copper tone. I wouldn’t be surprised if there were very few identical cars.

  14. Kit Gerhart Says:

    10 This is a more complete list of engines, with two different displacement sixes, and three different displacement V8s. The 283 and 327 V8s had multiple states of tune, with different power outputs.

    https://www.chevellestuff.net/1965/engine_id_codes.htm

    The way things are in “packages” in today’s cars, and the limited color choice, especially interior, the number of possible build combinations of today’s cars is tiny compared to in the ’60s. Yeah, most people don’t care much.

    12 I agree that we don’t “need” engine or transmission choices. Ford is really taking that to heart, with a turbo 4, automatic as the only powertrain for the Ranger. I guess no one “needed” a powertrain other than a 283/automatic in a 1965 Chevelle, but a lot of people wanted other options. I was a Mopar fan at the time,
    and I remember the engine options in a ’66 Dodge Coronet, when my father ordered one which I had later. You could get a 225 cid six, and V8s of 273, 318, 361, 383, 426, and 440 cid. Yeah, that didn’t make much sense, even then. Our car had a 361.

  15. XA351GT Says:

    Winter driving and stability really comes down to the tires. I watched a test of a AWD BMW x5 on All season radials and a FWD X5 with winter(snow) tires . The comparison wasn’t even close . The AWD couldn’t even get on the road course to do the test. The FWD blazed through with little issues. I watched a program on Motortrend called Everyday Driver where they compared a AWD Rogue w/all seasons against a Miata coupe on winter tires Again the snow tires wiped the floor with the all seasons. People for whatever their reasons budget, storage or stubbornness don’t get snow tires and the struggle on even barely dusted roads.

  16. Kit Gerhart Says:

    15 Interesting. I’ve never had modern winter tires, but it sounds like they work really well. When I lived in the “snow belt,” I always got by ok with my FWD and RWD cars with what were “regular” tires at the time, mostly all-season radials since 1981.

    BTW, the 2WD X5 is RWD, not FWD.

  17. cwolf Says:

    For me, the issue with winter tires is storage and swapping them out every season. There are now so fewer days when there is snow on the road for any extended period. Tire wear on dry roads and the added road noise is another consideration.

  18. merv Says:

    15 16 17, swapping out all 4 tires every fall and every spring is just a way of life in my area.

  19. Joe C. Says:

    The entire province of Quebec requires winter tires on all vehicles from Nov to March if my memory serves me right. I don’t live there but I’ve read that accident frequency has reduced during those months primarily due to the shorter stopping distances of winter tires.

  20. Joe C. Says:

    17 some car dealers will store your winter tires for free during the summer if you buy the tires from them. this automatically insures the customer is going back to the dealer at least twice a year to swap out the tires

  21. cwolf Says:

    20) That wouldn’t be a bad deal if my winter tires were mounted on there own set of rims and were already balanced. They do a really good job of keeping the roads clear around here so having them would still be hard to justify. There are always icy spots around curves and over culverts, but even snow tires wouldn’t improve that situation.

  22. Drew Says:

    Kit, the main difference between the product choices in the 1960s and now is that all the choices in the 1960s revolved around very few models (e.g., a full-size or mid-size Chevy) with many options. Today, the choices are around many different car and utility models, but with each model having fewer options. In summary, 1960 = few models + many options; 2020 = many models + few options.

  23. Kit Gerhart Says:

    22 Yep, few models, but lots of body styles for each one. With a big or mid-size Ford, Chevy, or Plymouth in the mid-60s, you could get a 2 or 4 door sedan, 2 or 4 door pillar-less hardtop, 4 door wagon, and in some cases, a 2 door wagon, and convertible. Now, you can get 4 or 5 different lifted 4 door wagons from Chevy and Ford, and a 4 door sedan or two.

    To me, it’s a lot less choice, but today’s cars are certainly much better in every measurable way.

  24. XA351GT Says:

    I use Bridgestone Blizzacks and they work fantastic. I have a nice set of after market rims for the summer tires and use the OEM wheels for my snows. When we bought my wife’s Crosstrek I bought a extra set of the factory wheels for cheap as the dealer had tons of them that people had traded in on STi rims. Lucky for me she actually likes the stock rims better.

  25. Kit Gerhart Says:

    24 Conveniently, when I ordered my 2016 Corvette, I liked the standard wheels better than any of the optional ones.

  26. Bob Wilson Says:

    Consolidation of power train and design into a single organization potentially could break down barriers . . . but ONLY if leadership makes that a goal. No, you don’t have to hold mass meetings and sing Kumbaya.

    GM needs to instill a new attitude of peer-to-peer, face-to-face meetings. So if one group proposes a given body, the power plant group can share their limits and reach a consensus … the absence of violent objections.

    GM has to stop ‘throwing the problem over the fence’ because they can’t figure out how collaborate. Otherwise, GM remains doomed because adaptive manufacturers will optimize their products and GM will remain a “C” class producer … wasting labor and resources.

  27. JoeS Says:

    Winter tires. I love them. Winter roads are not that bad here in northern Ohio but winter tires make those occasional bad days easy. Our cars all have had optional larger wheels with performance oriented rubber. Having winter tires also lets us have summer high performance tires. I get the winter tires and wheels in the smaller standard wheel and tire size so they cost much less than the larger sticky summer rubber. Save money and more driving fun.

  28. Lambo2015 Says:

    26 I’m not sure what you were trying to say but it sounds like you don’t think GM powertrain and body design collaborate? Which to some degree I would agree but its no different anywhere else. Powertrain always seems to be given direction of a certain size weight and purpose to develop a powertrain and meanwhile body chassis design is off doing their thing. Then a collaboration of trying to fit the powertrain into the chassis happens.
    That’s the thing about EVs that have started as true EVs from the beginning is they typically were a chassis or skateboard design that had a body designed around it or at least had a lot less influence.
    Just like having multiple engine choices with EVs you’ll choose one or two motors and maybe at some point 3 or 4 and with different size batteries. The collaboration will become a lot more apparent.

  29. Larry D. Says:

    A. Winter tires are completely unnecessary for the vast majority of locations. A close friend and colleague, who is now diagnosed with Alzheimers and is fairly advanced, even though he is 3 years younger than me, was always a poor but prudent driver, but the idiot would CONTINUE using winter tires well after the end of the winter, and damage our already terrible MI roads. I bet he never got a ticket either.

    B. I could care less about the Mach-E or whatever this phony Mustang is called, but I like the VW GOlf-sized and styled BEV much better. I bet they don’t plan to import it in the US, and they would be WISE NOT TO, because the US market does NOT care about hatches and does NOT need them even 10% as much as EUropean cities need them.

    That Golf at 24k Euros after the Gov handout is affordable, probably much cheaper than the far superior and bigger Model 3 there, so it’s good it does not have to compete with any Tesla.

    However, its range is DISMAL, in the US cycle it would be 150 miles or less, Leaf-sized and much smaller than even the failed Bolt. Germany and W Europe has much smaller distances than the US, BUT they also have a much less developed Supercharger network. So the E golf will be mostly an urban chores 2nd vehicle, and for long trips, NO problem, because over there, and 100 % unlike the PITIFUL Amtrak, they got STELLAR Rail.

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    28 GM made huge strides in operating efficiency, when they quit making four completely different 350 cid V8s. That got them in trouble at first, though, as Olds Cutlass buyers whined about getting a Chevy engine, never mind that the Chevy engine was probably better than the Olds V8.

  31. Kit Gerhart Says:

    29 Winter tires are mostly unnecessary, but if you have summer tires on a performance car, you need winter tires, or at least “all season” tires if you drive the car in the winter. Serious summer tires work very poorly when it’s cold, even without snow and ice.

  32. Larry D. Says:

    31 I always used all season tires. When I bought my 1975 Dasher (passat) wagon 4-sp manual in 1979, it came with two winter tires. Have not used any since 1980 or so.

  33. JoeS Says:

    The winter tires I use are not studded so they don’t damage the roads any more than an all season. The difference on ice is amazing. We usually drive to western New York for winter sports at least once a year in a FWD Vibe or a RWD pick-up. No problems. If I avoid one accident because of better traction the tires will have paid for themselves.

  34. Larry D. Says:

    https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2020/03/qotd-pleasure-cruise-for-the-isolated/

    Tesla is still running its plants, but VW has shut down theirs.

  35. JoeS Says:

    31 I once got caught in an early snow driving my RWD S-10 with summer performance tires and was lucky to get moving after stopping for a red light on a bridge with a half an inch of snow.

  36. JWH Says:

    Winter tires are a significant step up in performance in inclement weather compared to all season tires. Our 2004 V70R (AWD) came with summer tires & after taking a couple to Ann Arbor train station day after 8 to 10 inches of snow, ordered winter tires. I could get moving with AWD, however, turning & stopping were NG.
    As someone mentioned, second set of wheels makes swapping fairly easy (that was yesterdays assignment).
    Yes – I realize some people don’t believe in them, & when my 1970 Corvette was new, it was my only car. I got where I needed to go & this was prior to all season tires.

  37. FSTFWRD Says:

    I was really enjoying a “Larry D.” free day, but then…… I should have known he would find a way to comment about Tesla, one way or another.

  38. Kit Gerhart Says:

    36 A 1970 Corvette would be much better in the winter than a recent Corvette, even with similar tire compound and tread, because the ’70 had much skinnier tires, 205/70×15. That’s what my 1995 RWD S10 came with.

  39. JWH Says:

    #38 – Probably true – 2016 Corvette came out of hibernation last week. Early spring in SEM. I know that’s not an issue for you in Florida.

  40. Kit Gerhart Says:

    39 Yep, the summer tires are fine for me in Florida, and in Indiana when I’m there in the summer.

  41. Larry D. Says:

    37 Can’t handle the truth, eh??

    PS I tried hard and cannot remember, in all these years, when you even ONCE contributed something USEFUL to this forum. A unique non-achievement, not?

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