AD #2946 – China EV Market to Take Off; GM to Make Nikola Badger in 2026; Kia Moving to EVs Faster Than Hyundai

October 27th, 2020 at 11:50am

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Listen to “AD #2946 – China EV Market to Take Off; GM to Make Nikola Badger in 2026; Kia Moving to EVs Faster Than Hyundai” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 9:20

0:07 China EV Market Expected to Take Off
1:02 Market Manipulation Case Against Former VW CEO Dropped
1:37 GM to Make Nikola Badger in 2026
2:57 Fuel Cell Passenger Cars Won’t Become Mainstream
4:22 SEAT Testing Parts Made from Rice Husks
5:20 Daimler Cleaning Up Air in Its Buses
6:09 Magna Expanding Its Manufacturing Footprint
7:29 Kia Moving to EVs Faster Than Hyundai
8:13 Hummer EV Won’t Be Sold in All GMC’s Dealerships

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26 Comments to “AD #2946 – China EV Market to Take Off; GM to Make Nikola Badger in 2026; Kia Moving to EVs Faster Than Hyundai”

  1. Larry D. Says:

    It seems many of the regulars here have no clue what carbon credits are, and view them as an ‘unfair’ burden to polluters and also an unfair reward to the SELLERS of these credits to the polluters. SO I ask you, if the economist in AAH knows this particular branch of the SCIENCE, to explain to these unrepentant Tesla HATERS why they are NO HANDOUTS, they are 100% fair and appropriate and as they should be. It is NOT just that they are part of the Tesla Business plan. They are RIGHT. I only hope they were applied NOT only to Cars but to OTHER polluting sources, especially power mowers, of whom there are millions, and which are far more polluting than a car.

  2. Bob Wilson Says:

    “GM TO MAKE NIKOLA BADGER IN 2026″ – if GM relabeled the Hummer EV as the ‘honey badger’, the problem is solved. The Hummer EV needs a smaller cousin.

    “FUEL CELL PASSENGER CARS WON’T BE MAINSTREAM” – nor any other because no one is building out a hydrogen fueling network. California has a government subsidized, ~40 station collection to support ~10,000 private, many leased, cars. Only the port of Los Angeles works because Toyota provided both the vehicle and fueling station. This sure sounds like the Tesla model.

    “MAGNA WANTS TO EXPAND MANUFACTURING FOOTPRINT” – ah ha! The compliance manufacturer so folks don’t have to buy Tesla credits. The world needs more inefficient, overpriced, and under performing EVs.

  3. MERKUR DRIVER Says:

    1) Or you could view the credits as a tax on the middle class to favor the purchase of cars that only the rich can afford…which is exactly what it is doing.

  4. Lambo2015 Says:

    Sean here is an interesting article about the problems with edible types of materials being used in vehicles. You may have already heard of the problems with mice being attracted to the soy based coatings used in wiring. Not sure how rice husks will fair but could also be a problem..
    https://www.thedrive.com/news/20878/rodents-are-feasting-on-newer-cars-soy-based-wiring-insulation

  5. Kit Gerhart Says:

    2 Magna are a serious player in building low volume cars. They are now building Supra and Z4 and, I think, M-B G-wagon. EVs are where the growth is, as far as contract car assembly.

  6. MJB Says:

    Completely off-topic of today’s show, but yesterday I finally saw my first Harvester International Lonestar semi truck on the road. Up close and in-person, that thing is even more of a head-turner than the photos let on. Almost makes me want to be a truck driver just to sit behind the wheel of that thing.

  7. Lambo2015 Says:

    1) Still whining about a segment from last weeks show. (eye roll) People not wanting their tax dollars wasted on expensive EVs isn’t a Tesla hating thing its a complaining of government subsidizing a particular industry.

    2)What are you talking about? Magna expanding its manufacturing footprint doesn’t modify ZEV credits or make them a compliance manufacturer. It certainly wont change the purchasing of Tesla credits other than more EVs being produced makes them less valuable. Your a big supporter of EVs so what difference does it make if we have more with some being less efficient than Tesla?

  8. ChuckGrenci Says:

    When they build it or whether they build it, at least the Nikola (to my eye) is a good looking design, styling wise. And styling is as Peter D. says a major differentiator.

    When you buy/sell carbon credits, the same amount of carbon is created (just diluted per total units); so it is fair, how. It’s just a transfer or monies, and while the incentive remains and as MERKUR describes, Mr. normal guy picks up most of the tab.

    And I don’t know how to connect my observation that the California fires have created 25% more CO2 than the Nation’s vehicle emissions so far this year, it is a notable event worthy of inspection.

  9. Victor West Says:

    4 is right. Mice and rats living in parked cars is a real issue I have experienced. Giving them food increases the issue.

  10. GM Veteran Says:

    Just an observation: Tesla is not the only OEM that receives the ZEV credits, just the most prolific due to their volume of sales. Every OEM that produces a vehicle that qualifies receives the appropriate number of credits. That includes GM for the Bolt, FCA for the Fiat 500 EV, etc.

    I think the number of credits being issued should also start to wind down after a certain number of units. The OEM’s that are buying the credits now would need to get serious about selling Zero Emission Vehicles, which would help to reduce emissions overall. Allowing polluters to keep using the “credit crutch” just slows progress on pollution reduction.

  11. GM Veteran Says:

    Forgive me if I am suspicious of vehicle debut predictions from AutoForecast Solutions. The last one they had on the next Grand Cherokee was off by two years.

  12. Larry D. Says:

    11 Ιt may not be the only one but it is probably BY FAR the BIGGEST one. Tesla has already made more than 1 million BEVs. How many have FOrd or FCA, Tesla’s biggest customers for carbon credits, made?

    In any case all above is irrelevant, the point is that econ illiterates here believe that carbon credits are somehow a handout BEV makers should not get. Which is 100% wrong, and when you tell these unrepentant illiterates, they accuse you of… whining? THe morons who cannot see that 3*1=3, or, equivalently, that for the price of ONE $113k so-called Hummer BEV, you can get THREE 39,700 CYBERTRUCKS, that also look far more striking. But that’s poor Lambo for you, to count to 20 he has to take off his shoes and socks.

  13. Kit Gerhart Says:

    9 I don’t know when fabric wire insulation, like maybe cotton was used, but when I was young, there were a number of cars in service with it. It was tasty to small rodents, and maybe some insects.

  14. GM Veteran Says:

    Why does the price of the Hummer bother you so much? Because it sold out in ten minutes and will be in customer hands before Tesla even finishes engineering and re-styling the Cybertruck?

    Who cares how much it costs? I don’t hear any complaints about Bollinger, a truck that will carry a price higher than the Hummer. I am sure the Silverado EV will fill in the lower end of the price ladder for fullsize EV trucks.

    As with any other market segment, there will be a variety of prices, models, ranges and capabilities to choose from. Tesla will have plenty of truck competition. Ditto for the semi truck market where those crooks at Nikola will probably beat Tesla to market too. Seems like Elon needs to concentrate on the less-Boring parts of his business empire.

  15. Kit Gerhart Says:

    It’s sounding like there will be a lot of electric pickup trucks on the market in a few years, but do more than a handful of people want them? I don’t hear pickup owners I know clammering for them.

  16. GM Veteran Says:

    I think it could be a case of the early adopters jumping in first and then assuming they have positive things to say, and the press reviews are positive, that more and more regular truck buyers will move into them.

    Before too long, people are going to start worrying about resale values of ICE powered vehicles like they did in the final days of Oldsmobile, Pontiac, Saab, etc. Especially as more stories come out like the one yesterday on the companies deserting turbocharging production.

    Once there are more choices and prices are more competitive with ICE vehicles, people will start to adopt EV’s in ever increasing numbers because most people prefer to own future technology vs yesteryear technology. Anyone else remember a story from roughly two years ago about the last VCR being produced in Japan?

  17. Barry Rector Says:

    Sean,
    Have any of your sources said how much the investment will be for GMC dealers to sell the new Hummer?

  18. Kit Gerhart Says:

    16 I’ve heard that when Olds, Plymouth, and Pontiac were “orphaned,” the resale value wasn’t affected much, because you could still get parts and service at other GM and Chrysler dealers. I’d heard that Pontiac G8s, equipped the right way, are holding their value pretty well. When Studebaker went under in the 1960s, the value of the cars crashed badly.

    With EVs, the bottom line is that, for now, even fast, sporty ones are basically commuter cars to most people. Furthermore, they are commuter cars for people with a house in the suburbs, as many of us wouldn’t have a way to charge one at home.
    I’m not the only one who wouldn’t want to add 20% in the time to do a highway trip. Also, during the pandemic, fewer people would want to hang out in restaurants with other people talking about their cars during their extended pit stops.

  19. Lambo2015 Says:

    12 Larri, I’m not sure why I’m wasting my time trying to explain the most basic of math to you that my 4 year old grandson understands but I will try one last time. If you look past your hate for the Hummer you will see it has a base price of 80K and a fully loaded price of 113K. The Tesla pyramid truck starts Supposedly at 39.9K and loaded at 69.9K. So when comparing base to base and loaded to loaded the Hummer is never 3 times the price of a Tesla but I know you like to manipulate the numbers to look good for Tesla to fit your agenda. So if you are able to do basic math as you claim you’ll see the base is almost exactly twice the price and the loaded isn’t even double. Hopefully you don’t teach basic math or any other subject for that matter. Facts are facts and your feelings really don’t matter. All that and I did it with my socks and shoes on. If your still confused I will have my Grandson explain it for you. He gets it.

  20. Lambo2015 Says:

    15, 18 @Kit, I think that the industry is going after the BEV truck segment simply because packaging and weight are less of a concern. In addition to the fact that many people seem to want the large SUV and pickups but many cannot justify it from a MPG standpoint. So someone like a soccer mom who is driving a small CUV or sedan and isn’t really going far distances. Maybe to run kids to school, practice, the grocery store. The large BEV with even only having 200 miles or range could work well.

    For a long time I couldn’t understand the push for BEV trucks either but much like the evolution that happened when manufacturers realized that a small compact BEV wasn’t desirable and they started to make decent sized often luxury brand BEVs they realize the Truck prices of 60K+ can support the cost needed to be competitive with ICEs and trucks and SUVs have a ton of space to place a battery.
    Actually from a standpoint of whats been holding back the BEVs the large truck and SUV market makes sense. If people can own a large vehicle and not be worried about 15mpg and feel like they are helping the environment and were willing to pay 100K+ for an escalade then maybe they’ll pay that for a SUV that never needs gas. It may spark sales that have otherwise gone to CUVs simply because of the MPG difference.

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20 It will be interesting to see how the BEV trucks do. Like with BEV cars, you need a place to charge them, which would rule me out when in Florida. Also, if you drive them on highway trips, you need to add a lot of extra time to your trip. That would be even worse with big, draggy trucks than with cars like a Tesla S. We shall see.

  22. veh Says:

    21–Kit, my particular concern with BEV trucks is what happens to range when towing. A significant chunk of pickup truck drivers use them for towing. MPG goes down almost by half in our F150 when towing a small RV trailer. Fine, since refueling is a matter of 10 minutes, it’s not a big deal other than $$. With a BEV, we’re a long way from that, if it ever does happen.

  23. Kit Gerhart Says:

    22 I would expect the range of a BEV to decrease by a similar percentage to your F150, towing the same trailer. Then, unless they “split” the batteries of these trucks so they can be charged using two or more chargers at once, the charge time would be very long. A big BEV pickup truck or SUV would need to have a big battery, near 200 kWh to give 300+ mile range, when not towing.

  24. MERKUR DRIVER Says:

    22) It is basically the same in EV world. Your range will be cut in half when towing a trailer.

    Add into the fact that recharging while towing is going to be a big pain in the backside. Take the TESLA superchargers for instance. There is no possibility to charge your truck with the trailer still attached due to the way they are arranged. Well, unless you want to block access to every charger with your trailer. So, you will need to disconnect your trailer somewhere else, hopefully somewhere close where you can keep an eye on your trailer so nobody steals your stuff, and then go to the supercharger. Wait an hour for it to recharge, reconnect your trailer and repeat the process every 150 miles. That is not really all that practical and nobody will enjoy disconnecting and reconnecting a trailer just to charge up while traveling.

    The BEV truck will be for those who do not do truck things until such time that recharge times and set-ups are more inline with expectations.

  25. WineGeek Says:

    “Electrification is easier” yes it is, but there is still pollution the ultimate non-polluting vehicle is a fuel cell powered vehicle. It may be a longer term program but it is a better solution.

  26. Alex Carazan Says:

    CHINA EV MARKET: Consumers in China do not want EV’s. The same reasons USA consumers are not buying EV’s (their only 1.6% of sales YTD). Their expensive, low range, long time to charge, and little/no charge infrastructure. Communist Chinese Party is mandating them. This is not free market. The narrative being pushed is that this is some sort of free or natural market demand that is a positive trend. It is not. Ever wonder why pollution in China is so high? It is because of cars? China also has huge human rights abuses, steals intellectual property, and forces government ownership in business. Let’s encourage free markets.