AD #2947 – Acura TLX & Lexus IS Battle Heats Up; CR Rates Super Cruise #1; FCA & Daimler Post Q3 Profits

October 28th, 2020 at 12:07pm

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Listen to “AD #2947 – Acura TLX and Lexus IS Battle Heats Up; CR Rates Super Cruise #1; FCA and Daimler Post Q3 Profits” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 11:46

0:23 FCA Posts Q3 Profit
0:57 Daimler Posts Impressive Q3 Earnings
1:15 Daimler Boosts Stake in Aston Martin
2:04 Waymo & Daimler Trucks Form Autonomous Partnership
2:32 Hyundai JV To Launch Robotaxi Service in U.S.
3:02 CR Says Autopilot Is Distant Second Behind Super Cruise
4:42 Jaguar Introduces New E-Pace
5:53 Harley Creates New eBike Brand
6:53 Kia Developing Military Vehicles for South Korea
7:32 GM Defense Delivers First ISVs To U.S. Army
7:53 Magna Reveals Digital Rear-View Mirror
8:35 Acura TLX & Lexus IS Battle Heats Up

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46 Comments to “AD #2947 – Acura TLX & Lexus IS Battle Heats Up; CR Rates Super Cruise #1; FCA & Daimler Post Q3 Profits”

  1. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Daimler’s buying more of Aston Martin might have something to do with the Force India/Racing Point Formula 1 team being remained again to Aston Martin for 2021.

  2. Larry D. Says:

    I also was surprised at first about Merc and Aston and don’t have a great reason why they did it (didn’t they ever blunder like FOrd (a prior owner of Aston) and GM (both owned all kinds of losers and lost billions getting rid of them?)

    Except they may want to get a premium Brit brand, as their competitors BMW got ROlls and VW Group got Bentley.

  3. Larry D. Says:

    Before you get all excited about those two losers, the Acura TLX and the Lexus IS, you should tell us how few, (because it is NOT how many!) units they sold, and how many billions of $ they LOST trying to compete with the 3 series in the past, and with the mighty Model 3 now.

    As a matter of fact, look it up, and let’s have the four numbers: TLX, IS, 3 (and 4) series, and the mighty Model 3. ANd before you tell me the 3 series has many models, 4 door, 2 door, convertibles etc and it is not fair to compare, the Model 3 is ONE Mighty model, so it IS fair to compare to it and its HUGE, MONUMENTAL success, despite the range anxiety (on long trips only) and all the other concerns its owners may have

  4. Bob Wilson Says:

    Autopilot (what Consumer Reports reviewed) is standard on all Teslas. In contrast, Super Cruise is an option which mean only for those who choose to pay for it. So which one is getting more miles on the road?

    Tesla has offered something Consumer Reports has yet to see … Full Self Driving (FSD.) I bought mine a year ago at $6,000 and on Thursday, the FSD price goes to $10,000. Early reports are the Beta testers are impressed … but we’re Tesla people.

    The only FSD options I’ve tested is ‘summon’. When I return from the dog park, I often visit a restaurant leaving the dogs in “dog mode” in the car. When I summon the car, it looks like the dogs are driving it to me.

  5. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The Lexus IS from the 2nd generation on has been the most disappointing car Toyota has sold, at least in the US. The 2.5 V6 is was thirsty, with underwhelming performance, and the 2 liter turbo that replaced it is horribly thirsty compared to the competition, like the 3 series, both the EPA numbers and CR’s testing. I’m hoping the 2021 IS is substantially improved, even if not as “sporty” as the TLX. At least the IS is rear drive, as a “sport sedan” should be.

  6. Dave Says:

    KIA was originally a truck company when I bought my KIA Besta van in 1987 in Canada they largely built trucks including military trucks

  7. Kit Gerhart Says:

    4 Do you have a dog trained to ride with his/her front paws on the top of the steering wheel when you summon the car?

  8. GM Veteran Says:

    The comparison would be much easier if Tesla published sales figures for each market rather than a worldwide total. I think they are afraid of what those comparisons will look like as the EV choices proliferate at their competitive OEMs.

  9. GM Veteran Says:

    Quiz Time! What is the most expensive vehicle GM sells? Cadillac – nope. GMC Denali – nope. Perhaps the new Hummer – nope. Its the new ISV. At $360,700 per unit, it should make a tidy contribution to GM’s bottom line. Especially since the Colorado platform was already engineered and paid for. The profit margin on this vehicle must be sky high! No wonder they are enthusiastic about increasing their military sales.

  10. Kevin A Says:

    If you believe that Aston Martin could become another Ferrari, then the small amount of money to get involved could be worth it. FIAT made billions when Ferrari was spun off. Alternatively, Aston Martin could be a smaller investment replacement for Maybach, which cost billions but never caught on.

  11. Kevin A Says:

    I remember the story of Max Hoffman, who helped get VW off the ground in the US by moving you to the front of the Jag E-type waiting list if you also bought a VW beetle. I could picture a similar thing happening for mfg’s who sell expensive low-mpg uber-SUVs. For each one sold, add the price of a small cheap (but legal) Chinese micro-EV and donate that to a college student. Each uber-SUV is thus balanced with it’s own EV credit.

  12. Larry D. Says:

    11 Max Hoffman also brought Mercs in the US market after WW II I believe.

    5 at least the IS is RWD as real cars should be, while the Acura is either F or at best Awd or Fwd. ANyway the Acura is sure no benchmark for sportiness, the IS was a rival to the 3 series (one of the 20 or so that tried and failed, before the mighty Model 3 finally slayed the beast.)

  13. Larry D. Says:

    8 unnecessary. Do you even have the SLIGHTEST DOUBT that the figure of 75%, which is Tesla’s US Market share in PURE BEVs (it may even include all the plug-ins) this show has often cited?

    If you have a DIFFERENT figure from your old buddies at GM, what is it? And Please give us also GM’s share of the SAME market. What is it, 2%? No, 5%?

  14. Larry D. Says:

    9 what the hell is the ISV, when it was first sold, and, MOST importantly, how many UNITS have you sold? I could also ask how many millions have you lost making it, but let’s not be greedy… LOL.

  15. Larry D. Says:

    Looks like the Motive Theory of Evolution

  16. Larry D. Says:

    13 Never mind, I googled it, it’s for DoD. Are you serious in comparing it to vehicles that have to COMPETE in the MARKETS? Laughable.

  17. Lambo2015 Says:

    Oh noooo!! CR says Tesla Autopilot is a DISTANT second to GMs supercruise, ouch!
    Will Larry burn his Tesla pom poms. Naw he will just breeze over that little tidbit and try and say GM cant make money on a $360,700 vehicle. laughable. Life is probably good with that much separation from reality.

    Personally self driving isn’t anything I would be interested in, however the summon function or self parking would be useful. Not sure if you can have the car park at the far end of the lot away from other cars but I would want it to do that.. Being picked up at the door in the rain or snow would be nice but not worth 10K to me.

  18. Lambo2015 Says:

    Maybe Daimler is expecting a spike in Aston sales with the release of the next James Bond movie. Cant imagine there being any other advantage for Daimler.

  19. Larry D. Says:

    The ISV’s REAL price is 360700/20=$18,035.

    Why? Remember the $600 toilet seats the DoD bought in the 80s? I got a first class one for only $30 (in fact I paid only $15) so the ratio of what GM charges the stupid Government over what it’s worth is 600/30=20.

  20. Joe Says:

    Folks, just remember what larry d says is not to be question. He’s is the authority on all things. Just remember that and you will not run into conflict.

  21. Drew Says:

    Somewhere, there is a university with a staff member that has too much discretionary time. Perhaps they may want to keep him away from the students and staff.

    Bob, I thought the hardware for Tesla’s AutoPilot was included in each vehicle, but the owner had to pay an extra fee to turn it on (enable the software). To me, this is just another form of an “option.”

  22. XA351GT Says:

    Larry D @ #3 I got to give you credit for being able to insert tesla into a conversation it wasn’t even in . Impressive.

  23. Ed Says:

    I looked at the IS but it’s too small, I’m 6ft 5 and can fit in a 3 series, well any BMW, they know tall people. The IS seems to be for anyone under 6ft. Even the new corvette and the prior one is too small for my legs. If they could engineer from the inside out to fit many people not just go for outer dimensions.

  24. Larry D. Says:

    From CNBC:

    The 2020 election is set to finish with $14 billion in spending, smashing records, as this is more than double of what was spent in the 2016 election.
    By Election Day, the presidential campaign is expected to end up seeing $6.6 billion in total spending, while congressional races are anticipated to finish with just over $7 billion.

    More importantly:

    “Democrats have nearly doubled the spending by Republican candidates up and down the ballot.”

    This should surprise those who kept hearing for decades that the big bad Reps spent more $ than Dems. I guess it’s hard to convince voters to vote for somebody like Biden or Pelosi, even when Biden’s rival is the scorned by the corrupt Media Donald Trump.


    24) This has nothing to do with today’s topics. I know it is hard for you, but stay on topic.

  26. Bob Wilson Says:

    When I summon the car, my wife’s three dogs are usually sleeping on the front seats. When the car turns on, they know “Daddy Dog” is going to join them so they hop up to see where I am.

    The white terrier is normally napping on the driver seat and the brown beagle in the passenger seat. The black, long haired chihuahua seldom seen to make an impression.

  27. Kit Gerhart Says:

    13 From 1957 to 1963, Studebaker sold and serviced Mercedes-Benz.

    18 Maybe Daimler expects the re-named Racing Point F1 Team, Aston Martin starting next year, to help sell road cars. It actually might help a little, if the team started to win races. That seems unlikely, though, with “daddy’s rich” Lance Stroll, and over-the-hill Sebastian Vettel as drivers, even if the cars are competitive.

  28. Larry D. Says:

    Also from CNBC, markers are down 4% in Europe and 3% in the US across the board, all exchanges.

    Initially I thought it must be the threat of that econ illiterate Biden winning the US election, but it is not.

    THe reason is that MANY nations in Europe are doing TERRIBLY with the CV AGAIN, and thin of a SECOND Lockdown. Even nations like Germany and especially the Eurozone member where my summer home is located, are seeing a huge surge in cases while the US is again doing much better, AS IT DID in the spring, when Italy and Spain were hit hard, and France and the UK too, and above all poor BELGIUM.

    Belgium has about the same population of where I am now, bUT 10,000_+ deaths, while here the Media make a big deal that we went over 500 or 600 deaths, TOTAL.

  29. Lambo2015 Says:

    24 Think your on the wrong site. Not just from the political posts but actually all of them. lol

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    28 Yes, many nations, including the USA are spiking. The US is not as bad as Belgium or France, but not good. US states in the “midwest,” like Indiana, are not doing so well.

  31. Larry D. Says:

    France, with a population less than 20% that of the US, recently has more than 500 daily deaths, which is almost as many ALL of the US has, so it is five times worse. No surprise Macron, Prez of France, just ordered another lockdown.

    This should bring things into PERSPECTIVE. In the US the media have the tendency to always bitch about how bad the US is doing, without comparing it to the rest of the world.

    Spain and the UK are no better, and Belgium is MUCH worse, BTW. So France’s failure is NOT an isolated case in the EU.

  32. Kit Gerhart Says:

    31 Yes, France and Belgium have higher current death and infection rates per million than the US. Germany and Greece are lower. Netherlands is about tied. US territory Guam almost leads the world in current death rate. You can enter the countries you want with this very good tool, enter cumulative or current, per million or raw numbers, etc. with this very good tool, and make your own conclusions.

  33. Sean Wagner Says:

    Tesla is very slowly introducing a significant new version of its autopilot – the underlying software was completely rewritten, based on improved algorithms (took them long enough to realize the time domain required persistence).

    I’m actually impressed, but that does not mean true autonomous driving is here. Cruise is another company to watch – check their EV driving around SF on youtube. Worth it!

    As for COVID. Sigh. Keep yer facts straight. I recommend the Financial Times’ tracker.

    For the morbidly inclined 97 day rolling avg):
    Germany 38 daily deaths (heading sharply up)
    US 790
    France and UK 199 & 200

    Australia is again basically SARS-CoV-2 free.
    Like Taiwan (a very impressive prep due their acquaintance with the original SARS virus).
    South Korea is worth looking at too.

  34. Sean Wagner Says:

    Edit: 7 day rolling avg, of course.

  35. Ed Says:

    Oops! Sorry for my earlier post, thought this was a site about the global automotive industry. My bad.

  36. ChuckGrenci Says:

    @33 Ed, Just pick and choose what you want to read and respond to; you’ll see a lot of divergent responses, sometimes you have to ignore, get some ‘thick’ skin but mostly it should be an enjoyable place to post.

    Funny you say the new C8 doesn’t fit; I’ve heard on some other sites that a 6’5″ did fit (at least the website at Corvette Conti (where I get a lot of info. on Corvette).

  37. Kit Gerhart Says:

    33 Sorry about my off-topic reply to off-topic posts.

    34 I’m 5’10″, so would fit pretty much any car, but where I have the seat in my C7, there is at least 2 inches of extra head room, and the seat can go quite a bit lower. I’ve known very tall people who had to recline seats farther than they might really want to, to get adequate head room in some cars. Very tall, long legged people would have leg room issues with some cars, especially if they tend to “slouch,” rather that siting with their butt far back in the seat. I see some people in the local Corvette club who are wide, more than tall, who probably aren’t too comfortable in a Corvette, even though they can get it.

    Speaking of Corvettes, I ordered one, that I probably won’t get for about a year. It’s an almost zero option 1LT, Elkhart Lake Blue with black interior. I’ll have plenty of time to change the order, and I hope to see cars in most of the colors before I’m locked in. I’m considering adding magneride, which is available as a free standing option for 2021. Any suggestions, for or against it?

  38. Mark Brichacek Says:

    Congratulations Kit! Do you think you might be tempted to take the new Vette to a track event or maybe a autocross?

  39. ChuckGrenci Says:

    35, yeah, congrats Kit. From what I’ve heard around the forums, you really don’t need magneride when daily driving, as the suspension is quite compliant without it. I think it is a just under 2,000 dollar option so doesn’t go with your minimalist order but it is in a new fourth iteration so maybe it would warrant the cost.

    And an additional comment on fitment for a 6’5″ inch driver; when you get that tall (and I suppose even shorter people) there are a variety of torsos that can skew what fits and what doesn’t fit so take my earlier comment for what it’s worth; just something that I heard.

  40. Kit Gerhart Says:

    36 Autocross, yes, track event, more likely not. At 74, I’m kind of old for doing that as a “newby” with very little experience with that sort of thing.

  41. Kit Gerhart Says:

    37 The main reason I’d consider magneride, is that it might make the car more pleasant on the street in “tour” mode. If the car rides as well or better than a C7 or 2010 Mini without magneride, I don’t need it, and I’d rather not have the extra complexity. The $1900 price is not much on a ~$60K car.

    I saw somewhere that the most common trim ordered is LT2, and LT3 is more popular than LT1. Looking over what you get for $7300 with LT2, there is almost nothing that I’d care much about. Homelink, curb view camera, and rear cross traffic alert would be nice, but not $7300 worth to me. The biggest advantage of LT2 to me, might be the availability of “natural” leather for the interior, which should look good with the blue.

  42. ChuckGrenci Says:

    When I built my C8 (just Build and Price, no order), I chose 2LT for a couple reasons; for your reason of the “natural” leather interior (my pick) and the need to have 2LT for the optional GT2 seats (I like those). I can’t remember if you need 2LT for the curb raise feature but I would need that option for my usage. My built price was at 76k (one of the reasons no order for me………….at least not yet). :D I’ll be 70 next month so there’s that.

  43. Kit Gerhart Says:

    40 I think 2LT includes a front camera to see the curb, which would be nice. I need to be careful with curbs. Yeah, “natural” would be good with the blue, and with some other colors. I like red interiors with white, which is how I ordered my C7.

  44. JWH Says:

    Kit – We’ve got magnetic ride on our 2016 Z51 & I would order it again. I did get the optional update about a year ago. Different subject – I like the front camera use when parking to insure I don’t strike the front splitter on a curb. Best wishes on your C8 although I know it will be a while.

  45. cwolf Says:

    Kit, congrates on your Vette order. After reading what you and Chuck had to say, I had to smile. I think it’s funny that many new Vette buyers are of old geezer’s like us who still think young.
    By the way, Kit, If you can do without options and still want leather, you might consider having an upholster put in leather seat inserts.
    Sure a lot cheaper than $7000.

  46. Kit Gerhart Says:

    45 The seats in the base 1LT are leather, but with limited color choice. There are optional “sportier” seats, some leather, some suede, or fake suede, and the most serious seats available for track play are cloth, good for not sliding around. Different trim upgrades and packages are required for some of the options.