Episode 712 – Toyota Loyalty Remains High, Porsche Targets Ferrari, Four-cylinder EcoBoost

August 29th, 2011 at 12:09pm

Runtime: 8:43

Toyota owners remain loyal to the brand despite problems of unintended acceleration and production disruptions due to the earthquake in Japan. Porsche’s CEO says the company plans to develop a vehicle to compete with Ferrari. A look at Ford’s four-cylinder EcoBoost engine that’s debuting in the 2012 Edge and Explorer. All that and more, plus John recently got a chance to ride in GM’s EN-V concept car.


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This is Autoline Daily for August 29, 2011. And here’s what’s happening in the wonderful world of the automobile.

TOYOTA LOYALTY REMAINS HIGH (subscription required)
Toyota lost a lot of sales what with problems of unintended acceleration and production disruptions due to the earthquake in Japan. But Ward’s reports that loyalty remains high for Toyota owners. Jim Lentz, the COO of Toyota Motor Sales USA, says the company has won back all of its loyal car buyers and retained 75 percent of buyers intending to buy a competitor’s vehicle. The company, which just introduced the new 2012 Camry, plans to launch 20 new models over the next two years. The company blames slow sales on low inventories but expects levels to be completely normal by next spring.

Porsche is going for Ferrari’s throat. Reuters quotes the company’s CEO, Matthias Mueller, as saying “It always irritated me that the 911 tops out at 250,000 euros and then the 918 continues starting at 750,000 euros.” He says Ferrari has very little competition in the high end of the market and that there’s room for a larger sports car like the 959 that Porsche built back in the 1980s. Mueller says the model could cost between 250,000 – 400,000 euros.

And that goes well with this next story. You’ve all heard the saying, that the rich keep getting richer. Actually I like the version that comes out of the hollers, “Them that has, gits.” And this applies to high-end car auctions as well. Bloomberg reports that really expensive cars at auctions are doing very well, while everything else is faltering. One reason the high-end cars are doing well: high-end customers are pulling money out of the yo-yoing stock market and putting it into something more tangible, like rare cars.

Ford’s EcoBoost strategy is running at redline. Its 3.5-liter twin-turbo V-6 is a HUGE seller in the F-150, and now the company is introducing a smaller, four-cylinder version. This 2.0-liter unit is debuting in the 2012 Edge and Explorer with many models to follow. The numbers it brings to the table are nothing short of impressive.

I can’t wait for this EcoBoost engine to land in something smaller and lighter. Focus ST anyone?

The Channel Tunnel linking England and France is an impressive engineering achievement. But it ain’t got nothin’ on a proposed underground connection between Russia and Alaska. According to The Times, Moscow revealed an ambitious plan to physically link the continents with a 64-mile-long tunnel – roughly DOUBLE the length of the Chunnel – underneath the Bering Sea. Price tag? $65 BILLION! It would contain a high-speed rail line, energy links and a fiber-optic network. Tsar Nicholas II proposed a similar idea, but then this messy affair called World War I got in the way. Russian officials estimate the tunnel could carry 100-million tons of freight each year.

MIA EV (subscription required)
It’s fascinating to watch all the electric cars that are being built all over the world. Here’s a new entry called the Mia that was done by former Volkswagen designer Murat Gunak. It’s a cute little EV that offers a longer wheelbase version and a panel wagon. It has a top speed of 68 miles an hour, a driving range of 75 to 80 miles and can be recharged in five hours. But here’s the downside. Ward’s reports the price is, are you sitting down? Over $44,000. Even so, they’ve sold over 3,000 of them.

They say there are almost 7 billion people in the world and that we’re headed to 9 billion. So how does the automobile fit in to that kind of society? We get to drive GM’s vision of the future, right after this.

GM designed the EN-V concept car for an overpopulated world dominated by mega-cities. But this vision of the future is more than just a concept vehicle, it actually works, as I recently got a chance to find out.

GM actually designed three versions of the EN-V. One from its Australian design studio, which is the one I got to drive. There are also versions from its design studios in the United States and in Europe.

And that’s today’s report, thanks for watching, we’ll see you tomorrow.

Thanks to our Partners for embedding Autoline Daily on their websites: Autoblog and WardsAuto.com

88 Comments to “Episode 712 – Toyota Loyalty Remains High, Porsche Targets Ferrari, Four-cylinder EcoBoost”

  1. pedro fernandez Says:

    The first story of the day, “duh” and it never wavered among the loyalists, I guess Sarah Palin will now be moving out of Alaska with the Russkies coming in in droves, and it’s so nice to see how GM wasted taxpayers money creating a full size R2D2 robot, is a C3PO next?

  2. HtG Says:

    Wayward David Welch has a piece about GM’s Dan Ackerson in the latest Businessweek.


  3. HtG Says:

    @1 we’ll see who’s laughing, Pedro, when China buys thousands of those R2D2 things for all those empty cities of the future they just built.

  4. john787 Says:

    Why is it when Ford comes out with something new, this site raves about it when all Ford is doing is playing catchup. What I’m talking about is the new Ford’s 2.0-liter EcoBoost (better known to me as EcoBoast) engine that puts out 240 HP. VW and GM had EcoBoost equivalent years before Ford. Ford gave it a name and that is suppose to make it better? GM has a 2.0-liter 4 cylinder engine that puts out 270 HP and gets great gas mileage.


  5. Brian Little Says:


    The “MIA” should be pronounced at “M-I-A” as in common sense “Missing In Action”.

    Thanks for the good show.

    Brian “Chicken” Little

  6. Mike D. Says:

    Relative to the Ford Ecoboost. It is nice to hear that the take rate for the F150 is good. It does seem that everyone wants all the new technology until it comes to paying for it. On the Chev Cruze, the bump to go from the 1.8 L engine to the ecoboost 1.4 L with turbo is about $3K. I wonder what the take rate is on that option? Are consumers really willing to pay more for higher tech?

  7. pedro fernandez Says:

    My question is: how long will these Ford turbos really last? 100k 200k?? if they don’t last that long then they won’t be worth the savings.

  8. GPL Says:

    john787, maybe because until now the only thing GM put the DI turbo engine in was SS and Redline models. And those, if I recall, didn’t get all that great gas mileage.

  9. pedro fernandez Says:

    HtG the Segway was supposed to sell like funnel cakes at a state fair, since they came out I think I’ve sen a couple at Disney World.

  10. shan Says:

    @Pedro, they will self-destruct like everything else after 150k-200k+ miles. blown head gaskets, leaky seals and of course that the turbo will be the first component to bite the dust.

  11. HtG Says:

    You do wonder what young people that haven’t been shafted by the big three or FIAT are thinking. I know that deep deep down my feelings on some automakers is just deep deep bad. Almost PTSD like. I’ll look at the Chevy Sonic, but buy one? And the more I read about the way GM intentionally made trash, well, I think I am a lost person. Maybe after ten years of fine cars, I’ll be able to pull the trigger.

  12. Onslow Says:

    Saab has been building “eco-boost”s for almost 35 years and look what it has done for them!

  13. Chuck Grenci Says:

    john787 is more correct than wrong; even the Ford geek compared the new Ecoboost to Ford’s ‘slug’ of an engine the six cylinder 4L. I will admit that the Ecoboost 4 is right up there with the best (now) but it’s not like the invention of ‘sliced bread’ either.

    And Porsche vs Ferrari; performance wise, both top notch, but what has been said on multiple AAH shows and John’s inside line, design, design, design (Porsche, while unique, has a lot of catching up to do).

  14. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I like turbos, and have had a few of them, but I don’t think I’d want one in a work truck I planned to keep a long time.

    I found it interesting that in Consumer Repotts’ test of two Ford pickups, a V8 and an ecoboost turbo, the turbo got the same gas mileage in their real-world tests, but they liked the power delivery of the turbo better than the V8.

  15. Chuck Grenci Says:

    And a comment on the proposed Bearing Sea tunnel; makes me a little woozy thinking that both areas west and east have been the sight of some mean earthquakes. Upon further reflection, the story did mention “high speed rail”; maybe that could be a robot train (unmanned)

  16. pedro fernandez Says:

    #8 what engines are you referring to? I’ve known of several vehicles that have gone 200k miles and more with no major engine repairs, the days of 100k mile engine dying are long gone, mostly.

  17. GPL Says:

    Chuck, I share your sentiment. I’m not the least bit claustrophobic, but the idea of being in a 64 mile long tube under hundreds of feet of water gives me the willies just thinking about it before even considering earthquakes.

  18. shan Says:

    #13, all makes, all the junk sitting on used car lots, there just living on borrowed time. It goes like this, people buy new cars….after 3 or 4 years they grow weary of car payments or decide they’d better trade in before their car looses what little value it has left. By that time, the engine has high miles and has peaked out and will only start to show wear and tear. That’s where the used car dealer comes, spit shines them and jacks the price a bit. Then the former “weary” new car owner decides it’s time to purchase a lower priced vehicle with more options and that’s more appealing to them, but later they will discover all the gremlins from the worn out used car that looked so cool. How’s that sound Pedro lol?

  19. dcars Says:

    Porsche wants in on Ferrari market? who are these people that buy these cars? and what is the size of the market for these expensive cars? It seams like VW has a lot of high end brands.

  20. tj Martin Says:

    @ cwolf

    re; comment # 22 episode 711

    Damn you anyway cwolf :o As always … right again . So to all my detractors ;

    Thpppppppppt !

    Ferrari vs Porsche ;

    Would someone with half a brain please tell me WTH Porsche would want or could cars less about Ferraris market when in fact Porsche sells some five times more cars than Ferrari . Makes a profit on each and every one ( excepting the Carrrera GT ) and unlike Ferrari isn’t saddled by Debt that would make GM blush : as well as the FACT that Porsche Does Not need a Theme Park , $500 hair dryers , $100,000 limited edition books and more branded clothing that Harley Davidson , Ducati and Red Bull combined JUST to keep their pretentious heads above water .

    And to the one here who criticized Porsche’s styling .

    Well in a word son . Unlike the Ferrari’s of the last ten years

    Styling be damned

    Porsche’s WORK !

    Just try driving your 458 in the depths of winter . Heck try taking that FF abomination out on a daily basis anywhere , and watch it fall apart before your very eyes .

    Then tell me WTH Porsche should do anything but EVOLVE

    Porsche’s are CARs . MEANT to be driven

    Ferraris are Automotive Jewelry . Meant to be hung around your neck , kept in the garage and on the very odd occasion , driven , preferably with your Trophy fling my your side .

    FYI . I’ve owned Ferrari’s and still have very deep connections there but ….. I’ve Never owned a Porsche . Probably never will . But in truth REGRET wasting all that time money and effort trying to keep cars that in truth are Designed to fall apart on a regular basis on the road , and wish the heck I’d bought a single decent 911 instead .

  21. tj Martin Says:

    @ pedro

    That what you meant by guest commentator mi amigo ?

  22. RS Says:

    I know exactly how you feel about being stiffed by the car companies. 10 years is a little too short for some of my experiences! I, too, don’t expect to see a GM or a Chrysler in my immediate future. Those experiences “ended in tears” that will not soon be forgotten. I know there are companies out there who actually look after their customers.

  23. tj Martin Says:

    Mr director ….. please cue the entry music if you would . There’s still work to be done in these here parts .


  24. tj Martin Says:

    SAAB Story

    The never ending edition ;


  25. tj Martin Says:

    @ dcars


    Oh yes they do ….. ( VW owning too many luxury brands ) with most of them ( Bugatti being the worst ) losing VW money hand over fist on a daily basis

    Porsche only ended up in VW’s hands at the bequest of the German Government ( call this government subsidizing ) after their CEO brought the most profitable automaker in the World ( Porsche ) to its knees in an ill thought out attempt to buy VW

    But believe me … the Piper is waiting at the Gates of Dawn .. waiting to be paid . And He will get his due from VW … sooner ….. or later .

    That you can take to the bank

  26. pedro fernandez Says:

    TJ exactly what I meant, sort of like Andy Rooney at the end of 60 mins. Shan, you make me want to dump my freaking car and ride a bike wherever I go, I’ve had back to back Toyotas with 240k and 325k miles respectively so I cannot agree with your theory, perhaps you refer to certain American and European small cars that are not known for their longevity. BTW why most these cars companies want to be like others and not be happy with the market niche they fill perfectly, Porsche, please remember: “Like no other”?

  27. MJB Says:

    @ #4 :”Why is it when Ford comes out with something new, this site raves about it when all Ford is doing is playing catchup…VW and GM had EcoBoost equivalent years before Ford.”

    The same reason that everyone one their momma have been hoodwinked into thinking that Apple has started a ‘first’ with it’s new cloud-based OS, when Palm was the first to develop an OS from the ground up based solely on the cloud – WebOS.

    And the same reason that even though the WebOS does true multi-tasking like no other (including Apple), plays Flash sites without an app, synergizes all of ones contacts over multiple email and social media accounts into one convient interface (including the calendar), the plug was pulled on further hardware development by HP’s CEO.


    - and, yeah, incase you couldn’t tell, I’m a WebOS fanboy. I raced out and grabbed two of those firesale TouchPad tablets last weekend. (been with Palm products since 1999)

  28. pedro fernandez Says:

    #18 Shan I think you are referring to CarMax, they buy mostly rentals, clean them up nice, new tires, fix little defects and out they go for a very high retail price and those high miles, oh but they’re highway miles, right?

  29. tj Martin Says:

    @ MJB

    Errrrr. Hate to be the one to tell you this but ………. what’s sold Apple’s from day one …………. and still does to this day is one simple and inarguable fact .

    Unlike every other PC , SmartPhone , SmartPad etc etc etc

    Apple’s ……..

    WORK ! As well as last a good 60% longer and are able to be upgraded 75% further down the road than Any of their competitors .

    Apple may not always get there first ………. but they always get there Better .

    FORD vs GM

    As to the Ford issue today ,you need to partly blame GM for consistently shooting themselves in the foot , between lying about paying us ( US tax payer ) back , claiming the VOLT to be an E/V , stupid bragging that can’t be backed up etc etc

  30. tj Martin Says:

    @ MJB

    Oh and in case you hadn’t heard .

    FLASH sites are the most corrupted , error filled and easiest to hack into as well as lay in Illegal Cookies by an outside source

    Which …. is why Apple does its best to keep Adobe Flash as far from all its iPhones and iPads as is humanly possible .

    Adobe Flash is a hackers dream and a pc owners nightmare , the only reason sites using Adobe is because its the cheapest thing available and they couldn’t care less what happens to your device/computer

  31. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I’d probably like Apple, if they weren’t so arrogant, with their non-replacable batteries and silly proprietary connector. I have an iPod Touch in spite of those things, but I suspect I’ll continue to use an Android phone rather than iPhone.

  32. MJB Says:


    Alright… I’ve got another bone to pick with Mr. tj. Been waiting for this. :)

    Try these on for size (ther are plenty here, but just read the first, oh, six: http://www.amazon.com/HP-TouchPad-9-7-Inch-Tablet-Computer/product-reviews/B0055D66V4/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

  33. MJB Says:

    …All courtesy of Apple fanboys and girl like yourself.

    And, granted, I’m not claiming that the TouchPad is a better device than the iPad. far from it. But WebOS IS better than iOS. Period.

  34. HtG Says:

    Air or Pro, tj? And did you see McElroy’s Air on AAH last week?

  35. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Ford has been on a PR roll lately. In a bit of marketing genius, they gave their me-too turbo engines a name, and it has worked for them, with their turbo pickups getting lots of sales. For whatever reason, people are even buying the ancient Escape and the newer crossovers with the horrible operator interface. Also, people are buying Fords for political reasons, because Ford didn’t get “bailed out.”

    As far as my car buying goes, it’s the product. A year ago, Ford didn’t have even one product I would have been remotely interested in. Now, they have one, the Focus hatch that I would consider if in the market. I completely agree with Ackerman that Lincoln is a disaster. They have nothing that is not an expensive, rebadged Ford.

  36. GPL Says:

    tj, agree on Porsche. Matthias Mueller sees a gap in his product line between 250k and 750k Euro and thinks it is opportunity lost, but the gap only exists because of the rediculously priced 918 (that will probably lose money). It is an almost circular arguement: we’ve got to make more expensive products because we make an even more expensive product. I guess that’s why I’m not a CEO. I’m not smart enough to see his logic.

  37. tj Martin Says:


    To all the Honda detractors including Consumer Report


    Thpppppppppt !

  38. tj Martin Says:

    @ MJB #32

    Please !!! An Amazon.com review ? Hardly relevant .

    And tell that review to the guy we gave our ten year old Mac to that’s still running strong , as well as the three year old Mac I’m banging this out on , as well as the six year old Mac we keep offline for all our personal data .

    Speaking of which have you ever noticed how many Bugs & Virus’s out there , not to mention Hacking scams that DON”T affect Apples ?

    Security . And they work .

    Once You Go Mac , You’ll Never Go Back

    Come away from the Darkside MJB . I likes you too much to not tell ya this :o

  39. tj Martin Says:

    @ HtG

    Pro baby ! Gots to has my CD etc player onboard .


    FYI The wife and I been Mac/Apple users since the second commercially available unit .

    The wife because Apple was the first to support Higher Ed professionals and myself because for almost a decade they were the ONLY ones supporting Music and Music for Film software .

    So more loyalty due to providing the services we needed than Fans

    BWTM – The wife at her job has a monster of a Cray . Breaks down or crashes at least once a month . Minimum

    Our Apples over the decades ? Only one ( this one in fact ) has ever seen the inside of a repair shop ( once ) and everyone still ran when we donated/gave them away to upgrade .

    Top that WeBOS guy :o

  40. Bob in Atlanta Says:

    Pedro #7: Remember when the imported 4-cylinder “rice burners” first became popular? The “expert mechanics” claimed the imports had to turn high RPM’s vs. the good old V8′s running 60 MPH at 1,500 RPM, and the little engines would not last. How many old Corollas do you know of with over 200k miles? Probably most!

  41. pedro fernandez Says:

    # 37 but now they make you buy the top of the line to get what you used to get with the base model, minus the extra oomph, it’s like this Cruze eco and the Focus, they make you spend more to get better mpg’s.

  42. tj Martin Says:

    @ GPL

    Mueller is a hand me down from VW-Audi and is one of Winterkorn’s minions doing his each and every bidding so’s Kaiser Winterkorn can attain his overall goal for the VW – Audi Group .

    Which is WORLD DOMINATION ( winterkorn’s words not mine )

    Which is to say you’re in fact too smart to FALL for his logic .

  43. tj Martin Says:



    Just be patient my friend , the 2012 Civic is right around the corner and has learned a lesson or two from the Si .

    Take a look at the Euro 2012 Civic to see what’s on its way to our shores .

  44. Bob in Atlanta Says:

    GM-EN-V: Try it at Disneyworld as a ride, and get back to us.

  45. pedro fernandez Says:

    #40, let’s face it, no one could outdo the Japanese when it cam to 4 bangers, perhaps it’s the motorcycle experience or the fact that gas was always expensive there and 4 were kings, but just look at the crappy 4 cyl we had here in the 70′s and 80′s. Engine longevity specially in Toyotas is legendary and not a myth.

  46. HtG Says:

    Can you handle the truth, tj? When I got a mac, the genius said Apple expected viruses to eventually strike them as well.

  47. MJB Says:

    Oh man, tj. You sound just like my boss here at work.

    But you’ve gotta admit, Amazon or not, these are actual users. Not just paid reviewers who write a review based upon the first 3 hours of their interaction with the device. Nor professional reviewers who have already had their opinions tainted by the iCoolAid – barly giving a passing nod to features WebOS has in abundance that the iPad lacks.

    These are users who, after having used iProducts for years on end, picked up the TouchPad, experienced the WebOS, and came to the realization that Apple is not the only one with great solutions.

    Try this, if you want any iDevice to run faster you’ve got to ‘jailbreak’ it. If I want that for my WebOS device I simply add a free ‘patch’ created by the developer community openly acknowledged by Palm (HP) itself. In fact, I’ve had my 500MHz Palm Pre overclocked to 1GHz for the past year now. And my 1.2GHz TouchPad overclocked to 1.7GHz for the past week. No jailbreaking necessary because our OS isn’t on lockdown by the almighty iCzar. Takes 5 minuts to run and your done.

  48. pedro fernandez Says:

    Ain’t it grand to see GM wasting bailout money to build stupid little toys that no one is gonna buy, just when you think these guys have learned their lessons and are moving forward in a meaningful way, you see this exercise in stupidity and wonder what the hell are they trying to prove.

  49. Bob in Atlanta Says:

    Macs are for folks who just can’t deal with a blue screen. Life is full of blue screens, so get over it!

  50. Kit Gerhart Says:

    It’s faster and handles better, but it’s still NOISY, still has a mediocre cabin, and still has very un-exiting looks. For that money, you can get a GTi which is a more rounded, quieter car with a better interior, and it’s a hatch. Yeh, the Honda is more reliable, but I’d take my chances with the VW.

  51. HtG Says:

    I think GM IS trying to show that they are forward looking and technically sophisticated. Isn’t this a better thing to talk about than why Hummers are destroying the future for the unborn?

  52. pedro fernandez Says:

    HtG when you’re making so much money that you can afford to do these things, that’s fine, but they don’t . They’ve had to get govt money and ask their workers to accept less wages. Work on more efficient engines, transmissions, all good investments, not this.

  53. HtG Says:

    Fair point, Pedro. As I was typing, I also wondered just how much GM had spent on those mailboxes.

  54. vrmchris Says:

    hello to all.

    toyota. not a real surprise there. appliances sell in good and bad times. enthusiasts may get mad at toyota, but the average consumer generally is not disappointed.

    porsche targeting ferrari. really? keep in mind, matthias mueller may be a numbers guy. in that sense there is logic to what he is saying, however are you willing to take 30-40 years to get the cachet that ferrari has? porsche has a different niche in the market. lower priced, same performance level. without having to do the extra-curricular activities that ferrari does to keep their name out there.

    porsche financials. porsche does have massive debt because the family wanted to take over volkswagen. and got greedy in the process. car magazine had an interview with one of the family members who spoke in some detail as to the reasons involved.

    porsche design. it was the previous ceo wendelin wiedeking who famously asked, “what is a porsche?” that has every porsche looking like cousins to the kdf car. while that works on the 911, that aesthetic does not work well on suvs or sedans. stubborness is one reason why porsche sells so well in good and bad times.

    high end auction sales. unless you know what you are doing at auctions or the markets, you will get burned.

    ford’s 4 cylinder ecoboost engines. the differences between ford and gm are (1) marketing and (2) mass production of such engines. gm did produce a 2.0 litre turbo engine for opel in the vectra a,b,and c. and now the insignia. ford had only done so for the sierra and escort cosworth in limited quantities.

    reliability and durability of above engines. there have been serious advances in metallurgy, software, and turbos to the point where these engines are not the same as those produced in the 80s. yes i am aware of concerns by yourselves and others, but in 2011 it is less than before.

    tunnel under the bering strait. in this economic environment?

    mia ev. if you want it, ok. to the next latest and greatest.

    gm en-v. this has been out for how long now? yes, sometimes you have the answer the question of, “what if?” this transport module would require massive investment in the infrastructure to support such in cities and that will not be happening at this moment.

    thank you all. have a good morning, afternoon, or evening.


  55. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I’d rather GM waste their money on these things, than waste it on ways to make the cars worse like others are doing with gimmicky, non-intuitive touch screen disasters for control interfaces.

  56. tj Martin Says:

    @ HtG & Kit Gerhart

    Did either of you happen to notice which M-B is now the second response Safety Car during the Belgian F1 race ?

    As well as which Infiniti Vettel has chosen as his personal car as well as his Vettel Special Edition ?


    Seems all these young gun f1 drivers are going the SUV route for their daily drives . Hmmn !

    Oh and HtG. The Genius @ the Mothership told me the hackers are constantly three – five years behind Apple’s security upgrades

    @ Bob in Atlanta

    Macs are for those who prefer function , usability and dependability over price .

    @ MJB

    Speaking of the Mothership … I’m hearing a faint voice with a message for you from there ..

    move away from the Darkside

    move over to the light


    come to the light MJB

    come to the light

    :o :O

  57. HtG Says:

    I’ve got the MSFT PTSD blues!
    Yeah, if you don’t got these blues,
    Then all your bread’s down at the Infinite Loop.
    Oh Yeah

  58. tj Martin Says:

    Ferrari vs Porsche

    Part Two

    Porsche is not seen as the cheaper alternative to Ferraris but rather the better . Assuming you want to actually Drive the thing after you’ve bought it .

    Spanking a 458 in a GT3 on public roads is barely even a challenge . In a GT3RS … well its a cake walk

    Also vrmchris you might want to take notice that Porsche’s racing record is much more extensive , varied ( F1 – Rally – LeMans – Sportscar Racing – DTM – Dakar – Hillclimbs etc etc ) as well as a heck of a lot more successful than Ferrari will ever be . As well as the Porsche Cup being a whole lot better one make racing series , driven by pros … than the Ferrari schtick with overweight over walleted numbskulls pretending to be race drivers

    So they’ve ( Porsche ) done their extra curricular activities as well albeit at a much more intelligent level

  59. tj Martin Says:

    Ohhh for the days of the over the top Kremer 935 RSR’s tearing up the tracks in Germany alongside those whacked out Capris BMW’s etc.

    Now that was DTM my friends .

    You ever been HtG ? DTM that is ?

  60. tj Martin Says:

    @ HtG

    MSFT = ?

    PTSD = ?

  61. pedro fernandez Says:

    Kit, I also find all this “electrification” of cars stupid and pointless, I see in the not too far off future every new car will have all these distracting crap included, no choice for drivers. Research should go towards making vehicles more fuel efficient with the pending cafe standards being so strict, the most important research right now is to be able to meet it without making such vehicles so expansive that they will push even more people out of the new car market.

  62. HtG Says:

    was heisst DTM?

  63. HtG Says:


    PTSD=post traumatic stress disorder

  64. HtG Says:

    MSFT is the stock ticker symbol for the Redmond boys, tj

  65. XA351GT Says:

    MIA EV great name as it will definately mean Missing in Action when it comes to buyers at $44K . Good luck with that.

  66. HtG Says:

    OT for tj. I will soon have a 300 dollar gift cert. for Apple. What to do? Go for an Ipod Touch or reach for the iPad. I have a hp laptop.

  67. cwolf Says:

    When in for my monthly oil change, I always inquire about the number for people in for Eco-boost problems. Since they have been out,I’ve always been told there were no problems directly related. Although longtime Ford owners, I still would feel a bit uneasy having an Eco-4 in a Edge or Explorer until they shed 400-500 lbs. Mrs. Wolf loves her Edge, but I’m glad its hers and not mine.
    Is’nt booze illegal in Inuit country? When the tunnel is complete,maybe they could get used to Vodka! Ol’man Kennedy made a fortune during prohibition,so maybe a few of us could find opportunity to satisfy a need. Whaddya say?

  68. tj Martin Says:


    pay special attention to the ” Lower Price ” comments

    Ohhhh Hyundai ! Methinks I’s hearing the funeral bells tolling for thee


    @ HtG

    You dustn’t knows aboutism das DTM ??? Mien kampf ! Mein herr . Vas in da hecks has you beens all dees years mien fruend

    Ist no knows abouts das DTM . Ack du leiberstrand

    Ja and next he tells me he knows nussink about das Bach either .

  69. tj Martin Says:

    @ HtG

    1st choice – Cough up the extra $900 and buy an Apple MacBook Pro

    2nd choice (assuming you’re not ready for the light quite yet )

    Get the iPad . iPods are cute and all , but for me they’re kind of silly as I’m not a download kind of guy .

    OT Question HtG ;

    You having problems with Pandora suddenly dumping stuff on your station in spite of you constantly hitting the ” Don’t Like ” switch ?

  70. tj Martin Says:

    @ cwolf

    Firewater for the natives . Hmmmn . Ya know I seem to remember that ending up very badly way back when but then again……………….

    FYI Thanks for the remark the other day .

  71. Jerry Says:

    F-150 Eco Boost torture test


  72. HtG Says:

    @69 Yep, it’s the iPad’s big hips that are shaking themselves at me.

    Pandora-I stopped using it because it’s a little repetitive(a little minimalism wit for you gear heads). I listen to Q2 online from WQXR. The choral is fine.

  73. tj Martin Says:

    Well I’ll call it a day .

    Glad to see all came out of the wenches grip ( Irene) in good shape .

    God knows my home town got clobbered and an artist friend in VT was wiped out ( he’s OK but his house and studio went down river in the flood )

    Lets hope Depression #12 turns out a dud .


  74. tj Martin Says:

    @ HtG

    May have to switch myself . Pandora in the last three weeks has gotten out of hand with their shoving music down mine and the wifes throat on all our stations . I’ll give Q2 a try .

    Dang though I liked my Punch Bros station till Pandora went nuts of late

  75. pedro fernandez Says:

    #71 time it the one crucial test that you can not simulate and the true test for any engine, plus not everybody will do the needed maintenance during the life of the vehicle, btw all this was paid for by Ford so you have to wonder how impartial it could really be?

  76. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I didn’t catch it. Was it an AMG GLK or something? I really liked that hot E-Ckass wagon they had at Indy.

  77. cwolf Says:

    tj, you’re welcome. Share your love for hyundai,but uncertain lower prices from others will hurt them much as I would like. All the added toys blind buyers with those average incomes and I don’t think reliability is one of their concerns. Never the less,the truth shall be known.

  78. HtG Says:

    @75 That Ecoboost demo was super impressive. Though I wondered like you, what happens when a real life owner and subsequent owners with less money have the responsibility for maintaining it. That said, DANG!

  79. HtG Says:

    @73 Irene. We were just lucky. Towns along the Sound, and areas near rivers got flooded. Sunday morning I watched as the direction of wind shifted from out of the east to out of the west over about an hour. The center went over us. All automobiles intact, thank the Lord.

  80. tj Martin Says:

    @ Kit

    Yup SLS for pace vehicle . AMG E Class Wagon for the Doc and an AMG GLK for the medical support crew . Silver not white though . Oh well I guess i can’t have everything ;o

    Now if Jensen , Lewis , Michael or Nico would get one to wipe away the stigma of the ” Sex in the City ” connection . As well perhaps , depending on who it is that Fashion Editor who has one . But maybe not seeing as I DON’T KNOW WHO SHE IS HtG !!!


  81. HtG Says:

    @80 Face it tall man, you’re driving a chick magnet

  82. pedro fernandez Says:

    If that Ford test was honest, then I would not mind at all a 4 cyl ecoboost engine on a Focus, with the miles I drive I would also give it quite a workout. I am sure that Ford engine had frequent synthetic oil changes and they kept all maintenance up to date, it still is quite a feat.

  83. Damon Says:

    About that EN-V, where do I put my groceries?

  84. pedro fernandez Says:

    Just signed up for Truedelta reliability surveys and found very interesting info.

  85. tj Martin Says:

    @ HtG

    WQXR Q2 Two thumbs up . Bye bye Pandora and thanks for saving me darn near $700 ( $475 for the Pandora upgrade for the GLK and $179 for the Pandora capable DVD I was about to purchase )

    Oh and LoL for the ” Chick Magnet ” comment ( you do know by the way that I’ll be hounding you about the Fashion Editor thing forever do you not ? :o I’m really hoping its not the Devil in Prada ! )

    @pedro – Anything on the GLK in that Truedelta survey ?

  86. tj Martin Says:

    @ pedro

    Got into the Truedelta info on the GLK as a guest . A big fat Green Light ( which is very good ) and nothing untoward to be seen , so looks like Tj done well with this un .

  87. GPL Says:

    For some of us Windows vs. Mac isn’t an option. Most of my experience with Apple was back in grade school with Apple II’s. After that Apples were mostly irrelevant to me. My high school didn’t have computers for students. By then Mac’s were available, but were too expensive for me. I had a Commodore 64 at home, which served my paper writing and a little gaming, followed by a 386SX that I built from mostly used parts for probably 10% of what the cheapest Mac would have cost me. Almost every PC I’ve had since then I also a Windows PC either built, bought used, and/or upgraded.

    My universities had all PC’s in the computer labs, at least in the science and engineering buildings. As far as I know, even at the education level all engineering software was either Unix, Linux, Solaris, or Windows based. As a matter of fact I think Solid Works and Pro Engineer are Windows only now. I don’t know about other engineering software, and of course, most other working documents are MS doc or xls, and every company for which I’ve ever worked was PC only, so having a Mac at home doesn’t make any sense.

    I guess for other industries it may be different. I’ve always been under the impression that non-technical (music, arts, graphic design, etc.) are more Mac friendly, though few musicians I know mostly use PC’s, probably because they can’t afford the Macs.

  88. XA351GT Says:

    Uh, a thought on the Russia/Alaska tunnel. Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it awfully close to what they call the “ring of Fire”chain of Volcanoes and unstable fault lines?? Not sure about you ,but there is no way in hell I want to be in a 60+mile tunnel let alone one with those potentials disasters waiting.