AD #2354 – OEMs Should Merge Powertrains, Japanese OEMs Hiring More Women, Kia Stinger’s Structural Audio

May 15th, 2018 at 11:29am

Runtime: 8:17

0:35 Over Saturation of Crossovers Coming
1:14 OEMs Should Merge Powertrain Business
2:22 Cheap, Simple Sun Visor Supplement
3:01 Japanese OEMs Turning to More Women
4:35 Kia Stinger’s Structural Sound System

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32 Comments to “AD #2354 – OEMs Should Merge Powertrains, Japanese OEMs Hiring More Women, Kia Stinger’s Structural Audio”

  1. Lambo2015 Says:

    Automakers could consolidate engines as they continue to be of less importance to the consumer. Most people don’t even know what motor they have.
    The downside is however if they have a recall or other engine failure you’re talking millions of vehicles similar to the takata air bag recall.

  2. MJB Says:

    Design one of those sun visors for the windshield in order to block high-beams and those crazy-bright HIDs from oncoming traffic, and I’ll buy it!

  3. Buzzerd Says:

    While I understand how consolidation ” could ” save money on powertrains I have doubts it’s that simple. I for see this showing up in Lutz’s new book Bean Counters vs Car Guys part two.

  4. Lisk Says:

    Whoa. Is that really a serious story about the consolidation of engines? I know there is collaboration of transmissions but that has been going on for years with makers like New Process, Borg-Warner, etc. but the heart of the car, the engine? I can just see the Ford guy ready to sign on the bottom line and he finds out it’s a GM or Dodge powering his car. Sparks are gonna fly.

    The glut of [ insert class here] is common. Premium compacts selling well? We have to have one. Mini-vans are the rage. We need in that market. The compact crossover market is no different and it’s a class everyone can play in. GM and Ford gave up on compact trucks leaving it to Toyota and Nissan, and to a lesser degree Honda. GM buys back in and Ford follows. Now VW, M-B, and maybe Hyundai. Pretty soon the pie will be sliced so thin everyone goes hungry and players will leave again.

  5. David Sprowl Says:

    It seams to me that power train sharing has been done in the past. VW sold to Chrysler ZF provides designs to several OEMs. Ford and GM developed a ten speed. Least we not forget the Achates power is offering OEMs to do just that. Yet not one OEM has yet to announce such an agreement. Now talk about class 7 & 8 trucks and the power train is often bought “out of house” Caterpillar anyone?
    Great thought with a ton of problems.

  6. XA351GT Says:

    Lisk nailed it. The engine IS the car. If you go to a universal engine design , you may as well just eliminate brands altogether. Sorry ,but I find that a horrible solution. It irritates the crap out of me when a I see a car with a brand X engine that didn’t come with it. That heresy for a car guy.

  7. I.M. Buell Says:

    I really hope the powertrains remain a competitive battleground between manufactures. I view their competition as the main reason that the internal combustion engine and transmissions keeps surprising the general public (and our government) on its strides in efficiency and horse power improvements. I know, due to high development cost, many automakers have collaborated on engine and transmission designs in the past (like the new generation of 6, 8 and 10 speed transmissions) and I’m sure they’ll do so in the future. Hopefully with an Achates or an OPOC configuration. However, I think a whole sale consolidation of Powertrains would be a disaster, stopping innovation and would lead to the ultimate death of the ICE.

  8. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The engine still defines the vehicle, in some cases, like pickup trucks. RAM buyers want a Hemi, Chevy buyers want a Chevy “small block,” and these days, most Ford buyers want a turbo V6. Also, a Camaro, Mustang, or Challenger buyer probably wants a Chevy, Ford, or Dodge engine.

    Beyond that, though, especially with the example of 2 liter turbo fours, I suspect most buyers don’t care. There are about 10 different turbo fours now sold in the U.S. market. Some are no doubt better than others, but they could be used almost interchangeably. The main difference the customer would see, is that some of them recommend premium gas, and some don’t.

  9. Frederick Schmidt Says:

    No problem for Ford..they can get in early with making hot dog carts. Plenty of market space there. When thats saturated how about roller skates…won’t even need a engine for that market. Oh and on the subject engines..what a bad idea a common engine family would be. That will surely lead to new and better products. NOOTT!! In about 10 years the foreign makers will be destroying the domestics. Its sort of sounds like the auto industry in the Soviet Union. COMPETITION!! is what leads to innovation and great products.

  10. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I can think of cases where I’d rather have a different, purchased engine, rather than the one now used. The FCA 2.4 is generally considered worse than most of the competitors’ engines in power, fuel economy, and NVH. I’d be much more likely to buy a Renegade, if it had a Honda 2.4, not that I’m in the market for any vehicle in that class.

  11. Kevin Anderson Says:

    Chrysler, Hyundai and Mitsubishi used to have a collaboration on 4 cylinder engines. I think the design was common but they each manufactured their own. How did that work out? Are they still doing it?

  12. Kit Gerhart Says:

    A few months ago I read an article, I think by Jack Baruth, about the idea of only one 2.0 liter turbo four being made, world wide. He said he’d probably pick the M-B turbo four. I’m sure he was not completely serious in suggesting only on turbo four world wide, but he made a lot of good points.

    I wouldn’t go along with his suggestion, since the Benz recommends, and maybe even requires premium gas. Maybe there should be two 2.0 liter turbo fours, one with the best ultimate performance, needing premium gas, and the one that works the best on regular.

  13. Kit Gerhart Says:

    11 I think the current FCA “Tigre Shark” is the only one remaining from that project, at least the only one still sold in the U.S. market. It has probably been improved over the years, but I continue to see it described as not as good as most of the competition.

  14. Jim Bianchi Says:

    RE: Merging powertrain businesses. Your idea seems like a good one for the automakers, to outsource powertrains like they did other components (a la Delphi and Visteon) in the short term. However, with electrification coming over the next decade or two, at some point, it seems like powertrain will not be a growth market for the long term.

  15. Danny Turnpaugh Says:

    I definitely would not want a FCA transmission in my Chevy Silverado. Had enough problems with one in a Jeep Liberty.

  16. Frederick Schmidt Says:

    The future of the Peoples Auto engine plant products. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0n4U3lNFyA

  17. Chuck Grenci Says:

    On universal engines: let me premise this with an earlier story that said that there would no longer be any new engines built from scratch (just development of what is already being built). While this was probably an exaggeration, there probably is some truth in the indictment, so saying this, the high dollar money has already been spent for their initial development, so the saving of billions of dollars would not be realized even with consolidation. IMO

  18. Frederick Schmidt Says:

    We wouldn’t want to confuse the buying public with engine choices….just a little humor?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd5ka91fkDo

  19. Lisk Says:

    The winner in the consolidation of engines would have one winner. NASCAR. Now everything can be the same. All that would be left to control are the selection of perfectly spoken, non-drinking, non-smoking, males, aged 18-23 to drive the cars. Better yet, they could all be Honda Asimo robots! (What better way to get Honda in the sport!).

    I do agree with Jim Bianchi about electrics. Will anyone care if it’s a Toyota, Ford, or Subaru motor?

  20. XA351GT Says:

    I’ve wondered about electric motors. Are they made in-house by the auto companies or are they outside sourced and rebadged?

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20 I’ve read that the motor for Bolt is made by LG. I don’t know about others.

  22. Max Says:

    Several thoughts……..

    Over saturation of crossover’s coming? I’ve got news for you – it’s already here! And you know what the next “big thing” in the automotive industry is going to be? Passenger sedans! I can’t believe these high paid car execs can’t figure this out – too much of anything is boring, and so it will be, or is, with crossovers.

    The other thing – the day I open the hood of my Ram truck and see anything other than a Hemi sitting there will be the day I either start walking, bicycling, or but a foreign make of vehicle. The last thing I want to see under my Ram’s hood is a Chevy engine, or worse yet, an Eco Boost! Merging the engine business would be the worst idea ever!

  23. phred Says:

    Common engines?? GM did that with their “corporate Engine” program that finally killed Pontiac, Buick,Cadillac, and Oldsmobile engines. They settled on a Chevrolet engine for all!

    The sticky sunshade-can you see through it or is it a solid black eye blocker? Does not sound too safe!

  24. Barry Says:

    Sean,
    With the market saturated with SUV and crossovers, manufacturers need to come up with the next “big idea” that everyone must have!

  25. Lisk Says:

    23) The GM corporate engine came about due to the encroaching EPA regs as much as cost savings. Since the Chevy had the greatest volume potential, so it made the most sence to certify that engine. The Chevy inline six cylinder had been used for years in GM compacts since the sixties, only the Pontiac OHC six competed and it was too expensive in the day. The V6 was mostly Buick based until Chevy built their own 229 in 1978. Olds 403 engines went in Buick and Pontiacs as well. Buick quit building V8s in 1979 (I think), Pontiac in 1981, and I believe Olds soldiered on until 1987 (the 307), so the GM engine mix up was pretty universal among the brands.
    Cadillac had their own engines except in the Fleetwood until the discontinuation of the Northstar (2009?).

  26. Lambo2015 Says:

    #4 Lisk. When Ford had the Taurus SHO which was a performance version many people wanted it and it had a Yamaha motor in it. So surprisingly the motor if it’s good can be overlooked.

  27. Lisk Says:

    26) There have been many popular transplants done at the factory level. As you mentioned The Yamaha 3.0L V6 in the first SHO was the most desired because of the availability of a manual transmission. If my memory serves me correctly the 2nd gen with the Yamaha 3.5 V8 didn’t have the wow factor because of the automatic only status. Ford with Navistar and Dodge with the Cummins diesels were successful, but I believe that was because of the cachet of “real truck” diesels being offered in pickups. Crossfire SRT had MB engines. The Saturn Vue Redline also comes to mind with its Honda V6.

  28. MERKUR DRIVER Says:

    What will be the next best thing after the SUV?

    I think the wagon is the solution. Everything old usually becomes new again.

  29. Kit Gerhart Says:

    27 Wasn’t the 2nd SHO engine a weird 60 degree V8, made from a Ford V6? Or was there a 3rd gen SHO using that engine?

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    28 Wagons are great. They are better for carrying stuff than a sedan, with no compromise in mpg or handling, compared to a sedan.

  31. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Interestingly with the GM “corporate” engine thing, is that the flack, and law suits, started with a guy who was pi$$ed because his Olds had a Chevy V8, rather than an Olds “rocket” V8. The funny thing is, the Chevy engine was better, not having the short-lived aluminum rocker arm pivits, and being somewhat better as far as coolant leaks through the intake manifold. Still, Olds was the more “upscale” brand, and buyers didn’t want a Chevy engine.

  32. Kit Gerhart Says:

    27, 29. I found that it was a 3rd generation Taurus SHO that had the strange V8 based on a Ford 60 degree V6. It was automatic only.

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