AD #2977 – Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine; Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics; Cadillac Is #savingthemanual
December 11th, 2020 at 12:05pm
Listen to “AD #2977 – Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine; Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics; Cadillac Is #savingthemanual” on Spreaker.
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Runtime: 10:45
0:38 Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics
1:27 Hyundai Creates New Fuel Cell Brand
1:55 Toyota Set to Deliver 1st Fuel-Cell Semi-Trucks
2:18 Mercedes To Offer CPO Trucks
3:29 Hottest & Coldest Automotive Stocks
4:20 BMW Steps Up 3D Printing Efforts
5:16 Ford Practically Giving Away Fusions
6:19 Porsche Using AI to Detect Noise During Development
7:16 Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine
9:29 Cadillac Is #savingthemanual
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This is Autoline Daily, the show dedicated to enthusiasts of the global automotive industry.
HYUNDAI BUYS STAKE IN BOSTON DYNAMICS
Hyundai just made a stunning acquisition. It’s buying an 80% stake in Boston Dynamics, the robotics company that makes some of the most advanced robots in the world. While financial numbers weren’t disclosed, Hyundai values Boston Dynamics at $1.1 billion, which suggests it paid around $880 million. Hyundai’s chairman, Euisun Chung is even buying 20% just for himself, while Hyundai and its affiliates will control the remaining 60%. Chung, who was recently appointed chairman of Hyundai, says robotics will account for 20% of its business in the future. This makes Hyundai the latest automaker to get into robotics. Toyota, General Motors and Ford are all developing robots for a variety of purposes as well.
HYUNDAI CREATES NEW FUEL CELL BRAND
And speaking of Hyundai, the company created a dedicated fuel cell brand called HTWO. It says the new brand will help it step up development of its next-gen hydrogen fuel cell system, which will not only be used for automotive applications, but also to power VTOLs, boats and trains. HTWO will initially focus on the U.S., Chinese, Korean and European markets.
TOYOTA SET TO DELIVER 1ST FUEL-CELL SEMI-TRUCKS
And in other fuel cell news, Toyota is set to deliver its first two fuel cell Class 8 semi-trucks to fleet customers in California this month. The trucks were developed in a project sponsored by the state and will be used for drayage operations at the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach. Another 8 trucks will be delivered next year for the pilot program.
MERCEDES TO OFFER CPO TRUCKS
And speaking of big trucks, Mercedes created a certified program for used trucks in Europe. Trucks that are no more than five years old and have a maximum of 500,000 kilometers will receive the label and they’ll be inspected by Mercedes-Benz outlets to assure quality. The company guarantees the trucks won’t need maintenance for at least three months or 20,000 to 30,000 kilometers, depending on weight. And the trucks receive a 12- or 24-month drivetrain warranty depending on the model. The service kicks off in the first quarter of next year.
HOTTEST & COLDEST AUTOMOTIVE STOCKS
The hottest automotive stock yesterday was Car Gurus, the car shopping website for new and used vehicles. It closed at $26.86, up a solid 10.5%. The biggest drops came from Luminar, the lidar company, which was down 7.4%. That’s probably because Velodyne was listed yesterday and is a significant competitor. Fisker was down 10.4% after a research firm set a price target of $15 a share. Fisker closed at $15.03.
Ferrari’s stock fell slightly after the company’s CEO Louis Camillieri announced he was stepping down for personal reasons. Even so, Ferrari’s stock price is up 27% so far this year.
BMW STEPS UP 3D PRINTING EFFORTS
BMW is ramping up its 3D printing efforts and says it wants to integrate additive manufacturing into vehicle development and production. Earlier in the year, the automaker began 3D printing metal and polymer parts for Rolls-Royce vehicles. And another BMW plant in Germany, is producing 3D printed metal components. To engineer the parts, the company is using generative design, which uses computer algorithms to design the components. This results in parts with complex forms and structures that it wouldn’t be able to produce using conventional tools. While the components can be more complex, they’re lighter and maximize the space available. BMW is very bullish on 3D printing because it can help save costs as well as allow for faster development, more flexibility and the ability to make parts without complex tools.
FORD PRACTICALLY GIVING AWAY FUSIONS
If you’re in the market for a new sedan in the U.S., check out the Ford Fusion. Ford is practically giving them away. It stopped building the sedan in August but there’s still over 11,000 sitting on dealer lots and they’re being heavily discounted. Zero percent financing for up to 84 months can be had on all remaining examples and if you’re not down with that, you can get $5,000 off with a trade in. And dealers that really want to get Fusions off their lot, are slashing prices even more. Discounts of $10-grand or more are not uncommon and one dealer in Oklahoma City is listing a Fusion for under $16,000.
PORSCHE USING AI TO DETECT NOISE DURING DEVELOPMENT
Trying to find and isolate an unwanted noise in a moving vehicle is a very difficult task, so Porsche is helping out. It developed Sounce, an artificial intelligence program that is able to reliably and precisely detect noise. Based on the principle of anomaly detection, Porsche uses the system during tests to check noise development of load-bearing components. The big benefits are the ability to run the system around the clock, find the route cause of a problem and make improvements earlier on in the testing phase. It also frees up engineers who normally have to be physically present during the tests. We think this would be great for EVs as well, which are much quieter than ICE vehicles and where unwanted noises come through more clearly. Porsche says Sounce increases quality and reduces costs and will make it available to other companies too.
RAM TRX IS A SERIOUS OFF-ROAD MACHINE
The surging popularity of hard-core off-road vehicles is one of the most intriguing developments of late. As you know, Ram just came out with its answer to the Ford Raptor. The TRX, which they pronounce as T-Rex, is a serious off-road machine, and we recently got to drive one. The conversion from light duty pickup to TRX was significant. The frame was significantly beefed up to handle high speed off-road running. The front suspension gets forged upper and lower control arms and Bilstein Black Hawk shocks with separate reservoirs mounted to the frame. In the rear, there are 5 links to hold the Dana 60 solid axle in place. Put it all together and you get more than 11 inches of ground clearance and over 13 inches of suspension travel. Under the hood a supercharged 6.2 liter Hemi cranks out 702 horsepower and 650 pound feet of torque, all fed through an 8-speed automatic. You need that kind of power because this is an extremely heavy truck: 6,350 pounds. Even so, it shoots out of the blocks like an Olympic sprinter. But it also guzzles gasoline as if it were at the Munich Oktoberfest. The EPA rates it at only 12 miles to the gallon, which has got to be the worst rating of any vehicle we’ve ever tested. But as we all know, that’s not going to stop anyone who’s looking for this kind of off-road performance. Inside, you get that beautiful Ram pickup interior, which is still the best looking in the business. And it rides surprisingly well for being such a beefy hunk, so you can easily live with it on an everyday basis. Low volume, specialty vehicles like this don’t come cheap. The base price of the TRX is just over seventy grand, and the one we drove cost over $87,000. There’s got to be massive profits baked into that price and it makes us wonder when the Chevrolet Silverado is going to get in on the game.
CADILLAC IS #SAVINGTHEMANUAL
Cadillac is #savingthemanual. When the high-performance Blackwing edition of the CT4- and CT5-V hit the market next summer they’ll be available with a 6-speed manual transmission, which it says is quieter and more durable than the previous generation. Along with the manual will come GM’s first 3D printed components in a production vehicle. Two of the HVAC ducts, an electrical harness bracket and the medallion that sits on top of the shifter knob are all 3D printed. The Blackwing models will also offer an optional 10-speed automatic.
But that’s all we got for this week. Thanks for joining us and we hope you have a great weekend.
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Comments (40)
December 11th, 2020 at 12:15 pm
There are other reasons nobody wants a fusion HA
December 11th, 2020 at 12:27 pm
I think fuel cells are the power of the future, it may be way in the future. If a fueling infrastructure could be developed this offers the least potential pollution with true flexibility of drive range. What we need is someone to develop a cheap means of pulling hydrogen out from water. Ha, well maybe….
December 11th, 2020 at 12:43 pm
You guys had fun writing the bit for the TRX!
December 11th, 2020 at 12:50 pm
… if “generative” design only puts material where the forces involved require it, then have they done any work printing an entire chassis? I have to believe that removing unnecessary weight of most fasteners, plus the thicker metal areas where two components meet would have to save a significant portion of weight.
December 11th, 2020 at 1:18 pm
Sean; one thing you may have avoided on purpose but the question everyone will be asking. How does the TRX stack up to the Raptor? Sounds like fuel economy is defiantly better with the Ford but overall package would you pick the TRX or the Raptor if you were buying one?
The Raptor was first and basically set the bar which gave Ram a target to meet or beat. Question is did they meet it or beat it?
December 11th, 2020 at 2:04 pm
I’ve wondered why GM hasn’t gotten in on the Raptor market for a while. Seems like anything truck like sells easily.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:14 pm
I love mine. Great car, comfortable decent mileage looks great. It’s extremely reliable ,so I’m not sure what else someone would need in a car.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:15 pm
Fusion that is. I had tagged #1 ,but for some reason it didn’t .
December 11th, 2020 at 2:15 pm
5 The Dodge certainly wins the horsepower race, with its Hellcat engine. As far as off road capability, who knows? Few will use either off road anyway, no matter the capability.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:17 pm
@Kevin A – This is from 2017 but right along the lines of what you’re talking about: https://www.eos.info/en/about-us/press-releases/classic-car-meets-future-technology-vw-caddy-fitted-with-3d-printed-front-end-structure
And you would think that they might be able to do it even more efficiently today.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:18 pm
@Buzzerd – Chevy does have the Colorado ZR2, but obviously that’s not a full-size truck.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:20 pm
#6 GM appears to me interested in selling soft roaders than serious off road capable versions. Look at what they did with the Blazer,In a rush to get the nameplate to market before the Bronco they slapped it on the nest SUV they had in the pipeline. If Ford hadn’t announced the Bronco I doubt you see the blazer name at all. I know several Blazer nuts that are not happy at all with the Camaro on steroids they slapped the name on.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:21 pm
7,8 I bought the Camry hybrid over the Fusion because it gets about 20% better gas mileage, and because the hybrid version doesn’t lose trunk space and the fold down back seat. Also, I didn’t want to buy a car knowing that it would soon be an “orphan.” The Fusion is a decent car, though, and still looks good, even after ~7 years.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:24 pm
For Chevy, the LT Trail Boss edition is as close as they get to the Raptor and TRX. And, its not very close. Ditto for GMC’s AT4 trim (guess they let Cadillac execs name that one).
The Hummer will undoubtedly carry the off-road flag for GM, but it does seem like its only a matter of time before Chevy comes out with a competitive model.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:24 pm
Seems like Porsche’s noise identification machine would be awesome for people restoring older cars too.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:28 pm
12 Camaro on steroids? Huh? It’s basically, a Cadillac XT5 or GMC Acadia with different styling.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:43 pm
14 Since almost no one actually drives these big, fast trucks off-road, GM should take a different approach to a “specialty” pickup. Make a version in the mold of the SVT Lightning and SRT-10. It should be a lowered, regular cab or extended car RWD truck with the supercharged 6.2. A friend had a Lightning, which was a cool truck. Chevy could make a better, faster Lightning, and it shouldn’t cost too much to do.
December 11th, 2020 at 2:57 pm
Fusion – Three years ago we purchased a 2018 Fusion Sport (2.7L Twin Turbo) & are very happy with it. It replaced our 1996 Contour SE after 22 years. Have a good weekend everyone.
December 11th, 2020 at 3:24 pm
I have a Fusion Hybrid Titanium. I am happy with it. I use it for commuting and have other cars for the weekend. The fusion hybrid is reasonably comfortable and gets decent fuel economy. There are better cars out there, but not for the price I got on this Fusion.
December 11th, 2020 at 3:33 pm
@13 – Kit, the Fusion Hybrid has a fold-down rear seat. The 1st gen 2010-12 Fusion Hybrid did not.
If anyone at Ford is listening, nothing could have been dumber than announcing the death of your sedans so far in advance. It told customers to shop elsewhere. It told dealers to start “distress sales” tactics. Be honest Ford, it was Hackett’s desperate effort to communicate to Wall Street that he was doing something. He sure was… and Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, and Kia are very thankful to him.
December 11th, 2020 at 3:49 pm
I’m remembering the Chevy SS-454 pickup, the GMC Typhoon and the GMC Cyclone; Chevy/GM can do it, but currently, those are just history. The Colorado Bison is pretty good (very good) off road; just not a h/p monster. Three monster full sized pick-ups, too much; I don’t know.
December 11th, 2020 at 3:57 pm
20 Interesting comment. Yeah, if Ford hadn’t announced 2-3 years in advance that they were killing off the Fusion, I probably would have checked it out enough to know that the 2nd generation hybrid had a fold down seat. I probably would have still gotten the Camry, for the better gas mileage, but if I’d really liked the Ford otherwise, I might have bought one.
December 11th, 2020 at 4:02 pm
17-21 GM could kill in this market by just offering a 700HP LS motor on a slightly raised and widened chassis with bigger tires. I know many people that liked the looks of the Raptor with the wide body and larger tires but could care less about the off-road capabilities and the 70+ price tag. Same if they lowered it and went the route of the old 454SS.
December 11th, 2020 at 4:04 pm
21 There is an interesting story I heard from a former co-worker/race car driver about an attempt to break a decades old speed record at the Indianapolis speedway, using an SS-454. The record was held by a 1951 Chrysler, and as I remember, was average speed for 24 hours. Chevy wanted to break the record to promote the SS-454. They blew up two or three SS-454 engines, probably because they were geared too short for driving hours on end at 100+ mph. They ended up breaking the record, but with a truck with a 350 which stayed together, and was fast enough to beat the 331 hemi Chrysler.
December 12th, 2020 at 2:23 pm
A non-Mercedes took pole for the F1 race tomorrow. Isn’t that the first time this year, on a dry track?
December 12th, 2020 at 6:49 pm
I’m looking for a good race on F1′s 2020 finale; it looks like we are finally seeing some parity. Some good racing up front will be a welcome sight.
December 12th, 2020 at 7:19 pm
When FCA announced that they were building a full sized Jeep from the bones of the Ram 1500, I know that they would use Jeep tech to build a Raptor fighter! The TRX is an amazing vehicle, but the Raptor’s starting price is a good 20K cheaper. I’m sure no Raptor has ever left the dealership at its base price, but I think that the TRX has created another opportunity for Ford. Sure, conventional wisdom said that Ford has to put a more powerful engine in the next Raptor, when they introduce the new 2021. But what if Ford, while releasing the new Raptor with more power, then turned around and came out with a Raptor S with power to go head to head with the TRX?! The TRX is going to sell in much more limited due to its steep price. If Ford sold the regular Raptor with 500-550hp at a base price of $55K and a Raptor S with 750hp starting at $70K, they’d keep their current customer base and be able to challenge the TRX with little investment! And even if Ford chose not to go directly after the TRX, they still could bring their Ranger Raptor to the US and have two vehicles in the raptor family.
December 12th, 2020 at 8:29 pm
The TRX using the Hellcat engine is mostly about bragging rights, not because 700hp will add off-road capability.
Does Ford have a ~700hp supercharged V8 in any version of Mustang, or would they need to develop one if they wanted to compete with Dodge for those bragging rights? Chevy has such an engine, if they want to get into that market.
How many Raptors are sold? It seems to be impossible to find out, using normal search tools. It’s easy to find out how many total F-150s are sold, but not Raptors.
December 13th, 2020 at 7:34 pm
Kit , they have the engine used in the GT500 that is over 700HP.
December 13th, 2020 at 8:32 pm
29 Thanks. I was thinking they had a supercharged V8, but I didn’t see it listed in the EPA gas mileage site. I checked again, and found out why. It’s listed as “Shelby” instead of “Mustang.” It looks like they have the engine they need, if the want an SVT Raptor to compete directly with the TRX.
December 14th, 2020 at 8:42 am
27 I think your right that Ford offering two engine choices would be the best move to fend off the TRX from stealing Raptor sales.
However I think both Ford and Ram are missing a great opportunity to reduce the tooling costs of these wide body trucks by increasing sales with a much lower priced (body only) package.
As many have already pointed out here. Lots of trucks are sold every year that are 4×4 and very few use or need. I’m sure the same could be said for the off-road capabilities of the Raptor and TRX. The extra goodies are for a much more serious off-roader than probably 90% of buyers use. Not many are going to spend 80k+ to go jump sand dunes or risk a roll-over. They are attractive trucks and at least with the Raptor you get a basically loaded truck when you get the Raptor package.
I think they would be smart to offer a Raptor and TRX trim package that can be had on almost their basic trucks. They could take the base truck, offer the body package and larger tires and some graphics add 10K to the base truck and I think they would have plenty of buyers.
and just sell them as wide body packages as not to dilute the Raptor and TRX names.
December 14th, 2020 at 8:56 am
31) I would be for that. Have the looks but also have the towing and hauling capacity of the standard truck. The weakness of both the Raptor and TRX is that neither is good at doing truck things. There would be a broader market for people who want the looks but need a working truck and not an $80k toy.
December 14th, 2020 at 9:17 am
31 I’d think Ram would want to sell something similar to the TRX, but with less engine than the Hellcat. Probably the 6.4 would be best, to greater differentiate the truck from the mainstream ones with the 5.7.
December 14th, 2020 at 9:30 am
17. I think the market of lowered trucks is small as they seem to have fallen out of fashion. I see VERY few lowered truck like mine but there are some real advantages to them like handling and ease of use.
December 14th, 2020 at 9:42 am
34 The market would probably be small, but it wouldn’t cost much for a manufacturer to make one. Chevy should try it. They could even use existing lowering hardware from Belltech or similar, and really keep cost down.
December 14th, 2020 at 10:14 am
35 Belltech is what is on my truck but I’ve also worn holes in the tops of my fiber inner fenders, more so since I went with wider tires.
December 14th, 2020 at 10:46 am
33 You would think a more basic engine offering would make sense, but I think many of the buyers of these trucks like the bragging rights of having the top dog. Regardless of if they ever use it or not. Its like GM offering the ZR1 Corvette. The base Vette is an amazing car the ZR1 exists because there are people that want the top dog of Vettes. Will they ever go 200mph? Probably not, but they can say they can. It gets to a point that money isn’t a deterrent and its more about having the best.
Meanwhile the rest of society has to balance practicality affordability and necessity.
Which is why I say many guys have said they love the looks of both trucks but 1)Wont or cant spend 70k on a truck. 2)Don’t need all the off-roading goodies. 3)Wouldn’t buy a fully loaded truck and the Raptor only comes fully loaded. 4)Need the standard towing and capabilities of the average F-150.
December 14th, 2020 at 10:56 am
36 It sounds like for a proper factory vehicle, they’d need some work beyond bolting on aftermarket hardware, but it should be cheap to do a properly done SS, compared to these very serious off roaders with capabilities almost no one will use.
December 14th, 2020 at 11:02 am
37 Yeah, my base Corvette has plenty of power.
Don’t Raptor, and probably WRX have all of the “trucking” capability that most people use? I find that the Raptor has 6000-8000 pound towing capacity, and we learned a while back that 3/4 of pickup drivers never tow anything.
December 14th, 2020 at 12:39 pm
31, 33, 37, I think that both Ford and Ram (and if I’m not mistaken Chevy) do have trims that do what your saying. Ford’s I think is the Tremor and the Ram’s is the Rebel. Yet neither of these carry the weight and status of the Raptor and TRX.