AD #2977 – Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine; Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics; Cadillac Is #savingthemanual

December 11th, 2020 at 12:05pm

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Listen to “AD #2977 – Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine; Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics; Cadillac Is #savingthemanual” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 10:45

0:38 Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics
1:27 Hyundai Creates New Fuel Cell Brand
1:55 Toyota Set to Deliver 1st Fuel-Cell Semi-Trucks
2:18 Mercedes To Offer CPO Trucks
3:29 Hottest & Coldest Automotive Stocks
4:20 BMW Steps Up 3D Printing Efforts
5:16 Ford Practically Giving Away Fusions
6:19 Porsche Using AI to Detect Noise During Development
7:16 Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine
9:29 Cadillac Is #savingthemanual

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40 Comments to “AD #2977 – Ram TRX Is a Serious Off-Road Machine; Hyundai Buys Stake in Boston Dynamics; Cadillac Is #savingthemanual”

  1. Jim Haines Says:

    There are other reasons nobody wants a fusion HA

  2. WineGeek Says:

    I think fuel cells are the power of the future, it may be way in the future. If a fueling infrastructure could be developed this offers the least potential pollution with true flexibility of drive range. What we need is someone to develop a cheap means of pulling hydrogen out from water. Ha, well maybe….

  3. Marshy Says:

    You guys had fun writing the bit for the TRX!

  4. Kevin A Says:

    … if “generative” design only puts material where the forces involved require it, then have they done any work printing an entire chassis? I have to believe that removing unnecessary weight of most fasteners, plus the thicker metal areas where two components meet would have to save a significant portion of weight.

  5. Lambo2015 Says:

    Sean; one thing you may have avoided on purpose but the question everyone will be asking. How does the TRX stack up to the Raptor? Sounds like fuel economy is defiantly better with the Ford but overall package would you pick the TRX or the Raptor if you were buying one?
    The Raptor was first and basically set the bar which gave Ram a target to meet or beat. Question is did they meet it or beat it?

  6. Buzzerd Says:

    I’ve wondered why GM hasn’t gotten in on the Raptor market for a while. Seems like anything truck like sells easily.

  7. XA351GT Says:

    I love mine. Great car, comfortable decent mileage looks great. It’s extremely reliable ,so I’m not sure what else someone would need in a car.

  8. XA351GT Says:

    Fusion that is. I had tagged #1 ,but for some reason it didn’t .

  9. Kit Gerhart Says:

    5 The Dodge certainly wins the horsepower race, with its Hellcat engine. As far as off road capability, who knows? Few will use either off road anyway, no matter the capability.

  10. Sean McElroy Says:

    @Kevin A – This is from 2017 but right along the lines of what you’re talking about:

    And you would think that they might be able to do it even more efficiently today.

  11. Sean McElroy Says:

    @Buzzerd – Chevy does have the Colorado ZR2, but obviously that’s not a full-size truck.

  12. XA351GT Says:

    #6 GM appears to me interested in selling soft roaders than serious off road capable versions. Look at what they did with the Blazer,In a rush to get the nameplate to market before the Bronco they slapped it on the nest SUV they had in the pipeline. If Ford hadn’t announced the Bronco I doubt you see the blazer name at all. I know several Blazer nuts that are not happy at all with the Camaro on steroids they slapped the name on.

  13. Kit Gerhart Says:

    7,8 I bought the Camry hybrid over the Fusion because it gets about 20% better gas mileage, and because the hybrid version doesn’t lose trunk space and the fold down back seat. Also, I didn’t want to buy a car knowing that it would soon be an “orphan.” The Fusion is a decent car, though, and still looks good, even after ~7 years.

  14. GM Veteran Says:

    For Chevy, the LT Trail Boss edition is as close as they get to the Raptor and TRX. And, its not very close. Ditto for GMC’s AT4 trim (guess they let Cadillac execs name that one).

    The Hummer will undoubtedly carry the off-road flag for GM, but it does seem like its only a matter of time before Chevy comes out with a competitive model.

  15. GM Veteran Says:

    Seems like Porsche’s noise identification machine would be awesome for people restoring older cars too.

  16. Kit Gerhart Says:

    12 Camaro on steroids? Huh? It’s basically, a Cadillac XT5 or GMC Acadia with different styling.

  17. Kit Gerhart Says:

    14 Since almost no one actually drives these big, fast trucks off-road, GM should take a different approach to a “specialty” pickup. Make a version in the mold of the SVT Lightning and SRT-10. It should be a lowered, regular cab or extended car RWD truck with the supercharged 6.2. A friend had a Lightning, which was a cool truck. Chevy could make a better, faster Lightning, and it shouldn’t cost too much to do.

  18. JWH Says:

    Fusion – Three years ago we purchased a 2018 Fusion Sport (2.7L Twin Turbo) & are very happy with it. It replaced our 1996 Contour SE after 22 years. Have a good weekend everyone.


    I have a Fusion Hybrid Titanium. I am happy with it. I use it for commuting and have other cars for the weekend. The fusion hybrid is reasonably comfortable and gets decent fuel economy. There are better cars out there, but not for the price I got on this Fusion.

  20. Drew Says:

    @13 – Kit, the Fusion Hybrid has a fold-down rear seat. The 1st gen 2010-12 Fusion Hybrid did not.

    If anyone at Ford is listening, nothing could have been dumber than announcing the death of your sedans so far in advance. It told customers to shop elsewhere. It told dealers to start “distress sales” tactics. Be honest Ford, it was Hackett’s desperate effort to communicate to Wall Street that he was doing something. He sure was… and Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, and Kia are very thankful to him.

  21. ChuckGrenci Says:

    I’m remembering the Chevy SS-454 pickup, the GMC Typhoon and the GMC Cyclone; Chevy/GM can do it, but currently, those are just history. The Colorado Bison is pretty good (very good) off road; just not a h/p monster. Three monster full sized pick-ups, too much; I don’t know.

  22. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20 Interesting comment. Yeah, if Ford hadn’t announced 2-3 years in advance that they were killing off the Fusion, I probably would have checked it out enough to know that the 2nd generation hybrid had a fold down seat. I probably would have still gotten the Camry, for the better gas mileage, but if I’d really liked the Ford otherwise, I might have bought one.

  23. Lambo2015 Says:

    17-21 GM could kill in this market by just offering a 700HP LS motor on a slightly raised and widened chassis with bigger tires. I know many people that liked the looks of the Raptor with the wide body and larger tires but could care less about the off-road capabilities and the 70+ price tag. Same if they lowered it and went the route of the old 454SS.

  24. Kit Gerhart Says:

    21 There is an interesting story I heard from a former co-worker/race car driver about an attempt to break a decades old speed record at the Indianapolis speedway, using an SS-454. The record was held by a 1951 Chrysler, and as I remember, was average speed for 24 hours. Chevy wanted to break the record to promote the SS-454. They blew up two or three SS-454 engines, probably because they were geared too short for driving hours on end at 100+ mph. They ended up breaking the record, but with a truck with a 350 which stayed together, and was fast enough to beat the 331 hemi Chrysler.

  25. Kit Gerhart Says:

    A non-Mercedes took pole for the F1 race tomorrow. Isn’t that the first time this year, on a dry track?

  26. ChuckGrenci Says:

    I’m looking for a good race on F1′s 2020 finale; it looks like we are finally seeing some parity. Some good racing up front will be a welcome sight.

  27. wmb Says:

    When FCA announced that they were building a full sized Jeep from the bones of the Ram 1500, I know that they would use Jeep tech to build a Raptor fighter! The TRX is an amazing vehicle, but the Raptor’s starting price is a good 20K cheaper. I’m sure no Raptor has ever left the dealership at its base price, but I think that the TRX has created another opportunity for Ford. Sure, conventional wisdom said that Ford has to put a more powerful engine in the next Raptor, when they introduce the new 2021. But what if Ford, while releasing the new Raptor with more power, then turned around and came out with a Raptor S with power to go head to head with the TRX?! The TRX is going to sell in much more limited due to its steep price. If Ford sold the regular Raptor with 500-550hp at a base price of $55K and a Raptor S with 750hp starting at $70K, they’d keep their current customer base and be able to challenge the TRX with little investment! And even if Ford chose not to go directly after the TRX, they still could bring their Ranger Raptor to the US and have two vehicles in the raptor family.

  28. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The TRX using the Hellcat engine is mostly about bragging rights, not because 700hp will add off-road capability.

    Does Ford have a ~700hp supercharged V8 in any version of Mustang, or would they need to develop one if they wanted to compete with Dodge for those bragging rights? Chevy has such an engine, if they want to get into that market.

    How many Raptors are sold? It seems to be impossible to find out, using normal search tools. It’s easy to find out how many total F-150s are sold, but not Raptors.

  29. THOMAS NUSS Says:

    Kit , they have the engine used in the GT500 that is over 700HP.

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    29 Thanks. I was thinking they had a supercharged V8, but I didn’t see it listed in the EPA gas mileage site. I checked again, and found out why. It’s listed as “Shelby” instead of “Mustang.” It looks like they have the engine they need, if the want an SVT Raptor to compete directly with the TRX.

  31. Lambo2015 Says:

    27 I think your right that Ford offering two engine choices would be the best move to fend off the TRX from stealing Raptor sales.

    However I think both Ford and Ram are missing a great opportunity to reduce the tooling costs of these wide body trucks by increasing sales with a much lower priced (body only) package.
    As many have already pointed out here. Lots of trucks are sold every year that are 4×4 and very few use or need. I’m sure the same could be said for the off-road capabilities of the Raptor and TRX. The extra goodies are for a much more serious off-roader than probably 90% of buyers use. Not many are going to spend 80k+ to go jump sand dunes or risk a roll-over. They are attractive trucks and at least with the Raptor you get a basically loaded truck when you get the Raptor package.
    I think they would be smart to offer a Raptor and TRX trim package that can be had on almost their basic trucks. They could take the base truck, offer the body package and larger tires and some graphics add 10K to the base truck and I think they would have plenty of buyers.
    and just sell them as wide body packages as not to dilute the Raptor and TRX names.


    31) I would be for that. Have the looks but also have the towing and hauling capacity of the standard truck. The weakness of both the Raptor and TRX is that neither is good at doing truck things. There would be a broader market for people who want the looks but need a working truck and not an $80k toy.

  33. Kit Gerhart Says:

    31 I’d think Ram would want to sell something similar to the TRX, but with less engine than the Hellcat. Probably the 6.4 would be best, to greater differentiate the truck from the mainstream ones with the 5.7.

  34. JoeS Says:

    17. I think the market of lowered trucks is small as they seem to have fallen out of fashion. I see VERY few lowered truck like mine but there are some real advantages to them like handling and ease of use.

  35. Kit Gerhart Says:

    34 The market would probably be small, but it wouldn’t cost much for a manufacturer to make one. Chevy should try it. They could even use existing lowering hardware from Belltech or similar, and really keep cost down.

  36. JoeS Says:

    35 Belltech is what is on my truck but I’ve also worn holes in the tops of my fiber inner fenders, more so since I went with wider tires.

  37. Lambo2015 Says:

    33 You would think a more basic engine offering would make sense, but I think many of the buyers of these trucks like the bragging rights of having the top dog. Regardless of if they ever use it or not. Its like GM offering the ZR1 Corvette. The base Vette is an amazing car the ZR1 exists because there are people that want the top dog of Vettes. Will they ever go 200mph? Probably not, but they can say they can. It gets to a point that money isn’t a deterrent and its more about having the best.
    Meanwhile the rest of society has to balance practicality affordability and necessity.

    Which is why I say many guys have said they love the looks of both trucks but 1)Wont or cant spend 70k on a truck. 2)Don’t need all the off-roading goodies. 3)Wouldn’t buy a fully loaded truck and the Raptor only comes fully loaded. 4)Need the standard towing and capabilities of the average F-150.

  38. Kit Gerhart Says:

    36 It sounds like for a proper factory vehicle, they’d need some work beyond bolting on aftermarket hardware, but it should be cheap to do a properly done SS, compared to these very serious off roaders with capabilities almost no one will use.

  39. Kit Gerhart Says:

    37 Yeah, my base Corvette has plenty of power.

    Don’t Raptor, and probably WRX have all of the “trucking” capability that most people use? I find that the Raptor has 6000-8000 pound towing capacity, and we learned a while back that 3/4 of pickup drivers never tow anything.

  40. wmb Says:

    31, 33, 37, I think that both Ford and Ram (and if I’m not mistaken Chevy) do have trims that do what your saying. Ford’s I think is the Tremor and the Ram’s is the Rebel. Yet neither of these carry the weight and status of the Raptor and TRX.