AD #3324 – Cute as A Button $13,000 EV; Mercedes Issues “Stop Driving!” Warning; Renault To Spin Off EV Ops

May 13th, 2022 at 11:56am

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Listen to “AD #3324 – Cute as A Button $13,000 EV; Mercedes Issues “Stop Driving!” Warning; Renault To Spin Off EV Ops” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 11:27

0:08 Renault To Spin Off EV Ops
0:46 Nissan Undecided on EV Split
1:26 India Dreams and Drags Its Feet
2:22 VW Commits €3.4 Billion To Dividends
3:41 GM Mexican Workers Get Big Raise
4:18 Cute as A Button $13,000 EV
5:17 Lexus UX Updates
6:02 Toyota Venza Upgrades
6:20 Audi Offers New Package for S6 & S7
7:42 Mercedes Issues “Stop Driving!” Warning
8:18 CFD Models Turbulence Around Wheels
9:50 Magna Integrates Camera into Mirror

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26 Comments to “AD #3324 – Cute as A Button $13,000 EV; Mercedes Issues “Stop Driving!” Warning; Renault To Spin Off EV Ops”

  1. Lex Says:

    If the Microlino from Swiss-based company Micro which resembles a modern-day version of the Isetta is a success as a BEV, then VW has to bring back the BUG as a BEV priced around $20-30K USD depending upon trim.

  2. Drew Says:

    Lex, if VW does a BEV Bug, you can bet Bug Zapper jokes won’t be far behind.

  3. GM Veteran Says:

    In my mind, using the term spinoff when describing what the auto companies have done with their EV operations is misleading. A spinoff is usually when a portion of a company becomes totally independent of the main company. A good example is when GM spun off its supplier operations as one big unit that became Delphi. You could buy its stock, it had its own management and was totally independent of GM other than for the fact that it had contracts to sell parts and components to GM.

    In the case of Ford and perhaps now Renault, I think the better term would be division. Ford will have an EV division and an ICE division, each with their own name, but still totally owned and operated by Ford. And all employees of both will be Ford employees.

  4. Bob Wilson Says:

    The EPA requires rigorous roll-down tests and shares the data in the ‘test car database’. It provides a way to calculate the drag force at speeds 20-80 mph using a quadratic formula. Multiplied by the velocity and a units constant, you get the drag power in HP or kW. This is very useful when comparing different cars and even model years.

  5. Roger T Says:

    So the Microlino gets 100+ miles of range with 10kWh? Something isn’t right, either max speed is 20 or that range number is not right

  6. Kit Gerhart Says:

    5 The top speed is 90 km/h, about 45 mph, and the vehicle is very small and light. Still, that range is higher than I would expect, for such a small battery. The range rating is presumably WTLP, which, in most cases, is higher than the EPA rating would be.

  7. MJB Says:

    Alright Audi! Glad to see an automaker bucking the trend by introducing a special “Design Edition” without black wheels!!

    I guess that hidden Magna mirror cam means no more covert nose picking behind the wheel. ;)

  8. Kit Gerhart Says:

    7 It’s nice that Audi stayed away from black wheels for their “special editions,” but grey as the only paint color? Why?

  9. Bob Wilson Says:

    So EVs have about two orders of magnitude, 1/100 th, moving parts. There are competing chemistry which spreads the resource risk. Yet the announced new EV models are years back ordered.

    This would be a great subject for next week after hours but I have no clue who to invite. Certainly Sandy Munro would be credible.

  10. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I’d like to hear a discussion about why some EVs are much more efficient than others. I think I know part of it. Tesla’s motors are probably more efficient than most, and Jaguar’s “different” motors less efficient. Also, it looks like cylindrical cells are good, since Tesla and Lucid use them, and have good efficiency. What else is going on, like with the poor efficiency of Taycan and E-tron, and so-so efficiency of Mach-E?

  11. MJB Says:

    #8 I agree. But it doesn’t surprise me entirely. Wasn’t the GNX version of the Buick Grand National offered only in black?

  12. MJB Says:

    #8 I agree. But it doesn’t surprise me entirely. Wasn’t the GNX version of the Buick Grand National offered only in black?

  13. MJB Says:

    …Which, btw, was the first car to look ‘good’ with black wheel, IMHO. Forget those lame-looking black hub caps on the Knight Rider KITT car.

  14. Kit Gerhart Says:

    12 Yeah, the GNX was black only, and maybe the Grand National. You could get the same powertrain in a Regal T-type in various colors. I guess you would also be able to get a regular Audi S6 and S7 in actual colors, but not the “special.”

  15. Kit Gerhart Says:

    13 To me, black wheels remind of of cars of my youth, after the wheel covers fell off and were lost.

  16. motorman Says:

    that micro car is it a 1 man or 2 man coffin ??

  17. ChuckGrenci Says:

    Very few cars look good in black wheels IMO (they seem to look dirty all the time). I’ve seen a couple of bright green cars that looked good in black wheels and maybe a red one or two but generally not impressed with black.

  18. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I find it interesting that, while cars went from “nothing but black” Model Ts, to red and green cars with yellow wheels in the late 20s to mid 30s. How did today’s grey cars with black wheels thing come to be? I like color in cars, and other things.

  19. Roger T Says:

    #6 & 10 – thanks for your comment, it explains the range, they probably expect the ave speed to be very low.
    Regarding efficiency, two areas are key – aero and drivetrain resistance. Tesla aero is among the best, then second would be rolling resistance (tire choice and bearings), third motor efficiency. Suggest you look at Aptera, lots of good information on this topic for that car. Info on YouTube. Thx

  20. Kit Gerhart Says:

    19 I checked out the Aptera site. Interesting. I hope they make a go of it. If they do, that should work for most of my driving in Florida, without home charging. It wouldn’t be good in a crash, but I’d chance it. I ride motorcycles, which would be much worse in a crash.

    It turns out that Tesla compromises in one area, at least with the Model 3, which is rolling resistance. They use special foam lined tires to reduce road noise, while adding rolling resistance compared to other tires. The car is lighter than the competition, probably partly because they don’t have much sound deadening, which is why the use the special tires. In the end, the Model 3 is still about the most efficient EV available, and will be more efficient if you compromise a little on cabin noise, and use LRR tires when the original ones wear out. Bob Wilson who posts here mentioned doing that, and not noticing much difference in noise.

  21. ChuckGrenci Says:

    LRR tires are good for economy but have been reported a compromise in wet traction. If the miles per energy spent is better, but without similar traction, I’d take the ‘hit’ and use the safer tires.

  22. Kit Gerhart Says:

    21 LRR tires are somewhat of a compromise in both wet and dry traction, but I haven’t found it to be a problem. I tend to “take it easy” with cornering in the wet, regardless of tires, so I haven’t really tested the limit of wet traction. I’ve had LRR tires on Priuses and a Camry hybrid. In the end, I suspect there would be little gain in mpg, except with relatively efficient cars.

  23. Bob Wilson Says:

    Switched reluctance motors provide a way to reduce back EMF to reduce the drive voltage. Munro has pointed out the Tesla permanent magnets are industry leading strong. Also, SiC power switches are more efficient than cheaper silicon only. Tesla thermal management is very efficient.

  24. Kit Gerhart Says:

    21,22 I just looked up the tires that came on my Highlander, and they are not LRR. That would indicate that LRR tires don’t improve mpg enough on a draggy vehicle like that to improve the EPA ratings, even on the highest mileage version, the FWD hybrid. Toyota probably would have used LRR tires as original equipment, if they would have gotten another mpg in the tests.

  25. Bob Wilson Says:

    About Tesla Model 3 wheels and tires, they are the same for all variants though the EV power and gross weights vary. My Std Rng Plus is the lightest so replacement with lighter rims and tires saves both weight and wheel polar moment of inertia.

  26. Kit Gerhart Says:

    25 Narrower tires are good for efficiency, but sizes are limited, if you want to, say, go 10mm narrower, and from 65 to 70 aspect ratio. 70s used to be called “wide oval,” but now, they barely exist.

    Your i3 has skinny tires, good for efficiency, but few are available in those sizes.