AD #1263 – 2015 Subaru WRX, Kia Introduces 1st Rear-Drive Sedan, Honda’s Wild FCEV Concept

November 21st, 2013 at 11:47am

Runtime: 6:45

- 2015 Subaru WRX
- Mercedes Concept GLA45 AMG
- Kia Introduces 1st Rear-Drive Sedan
- Hyundai Introduces Fuel Cell Santa Fe
- Honda’s Wild FCEV Concept
- VW Twin Up! Eye-Popping MPG’s

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Hello and welcome to a brand new edition of Autoline Daily. I’m Murray Feldman, from FOX 2 News in Detroit filling in for John while he’s out at the LA Auto Show. And now we’ve got some more reveals to look at.

First up is the 2015 Subaru WRX. We showed you this teaser shot last week but now we’ve got the whole car to show you. It’s built on an all-new stiffer platform and its wheelbase is one inch longer than before. It’s powered by a new turbocharged 2-Liter, 4-cylinder Boxer engine with direct fuel injection which can be paired with a new six-speed manual or a continuously variable transmission. The new powertrain is able to crank out 268 horsepower along with 258 pound feet of torque. And of course it wouldn’t be a Subaru without all-wheel drive, which in the 2015 WRX, is supplemented by a new torque-vectoring system, to help improve cornering and handling.

Mercedes unveiled this high-performance compact SUV concept called the GLA45 AMG. It’s powered by a 2-Liter, turbocharged 4-cylinder engine that puts out 355 horsepower and 332 pound feet of torque. The engine is mated to a seven-speed dual-clutch transmission. This setup helps the Concept GLA45 AMG scream from zero to sixty miles-per-hour in under five seconds.

Kia is dipping its toes into the luxury segment with its first ever rear-drive sedan called the K900. It features the company’s signature grille on the front and in our opinion has better overall styling than its cousin, the Hyundai Equus. Customers get two engine choices…a 3.8 liter V6 or a 5-Liter V8 that cranks out 420 horsepower. Both engines feature direct injection and are mated to an 8-speed automatic transmission. Pricing for the K900 will be announced closer to its launch when it goes on sale early next year.

Now that sales of battery electric cars are struggling to sell in big volume, automakers are turning their attention to fuel cells. Hyundai just unveiled this fuel cell powered Santa Fe car at the LA auto show. It will be available in the U.S. market next spring for a $499 a month lease for 36 months with $3,000 down. And Hyundai will pay for all the fuel and maintenance on the car. The range is estimated at 300 miles per tank, and it will only take about 7 minutes to fill the tank. “This will make BEV’s feel old-fashioned,” says John Krafcik, the CEO of Hyundai Motor America. The company has the capacity to make 1,000 fuel cell cars for worldwide sale by 2016 and will advertise it using the tag line: “We’ve re-imagined the EV.” Even so, only customers who live near a hydrogen fueling station will be able to use a fuel cell car, and there are very few hydrogen stations anywhere in the world. So even if fuel cells are the powertrain of the future, that future is still years down the road.

And speaking of fuel cells, last week we showed you this teaser image of Honda’s Concept FCEV or fuel cell-electric vehicle. And in the flesh, it’s nearly as wild-looking as the sketch with its pronounced character lines ahead of the front and rear wheels and ultra aerodynamic body. The concept shows us the design direction for Honda’s next-generation fuel cell that comes out in 2015. It will have the entire fuel cell powertrain packaged into the engine bay, which allows for more cabin space and potential application into other vehicles. The concept has space and seating for 5 passengers. The next-gen FCEV is also anticipated to deliver a driving range of more than 300 miles with a quick refueling time of about three minutes.

We had heard rumblings that the powertrain from Volkswagen’s 260 mile-per-gallon XL1 would be used in another vehicle, and the German automaker pulled the wraps off it at the Tokyo Motor Show. Called the twin up!, it’s a 4 seat vehicle that gets the XL1’s plug-in diesel hybrid powertrain and boasts fuel economy of 214 miles-per-gallon on the European test cycle. No word yet though if we’ll get to see the twin up! roaming the streets.

Coming up next, some of my thoughts on the growth of in-car technology.

Several years ago at the North American International Auto Show here in Detroit. A corporate executive talked me into getting into one of their cars so I could see the new technology. I said..sure. I’ll do a story on it. He said,you can’t it doesn’t work yet. It’s just for show. It’ll be out next year.

Now years later. I think a lot of consumers will tell you it still doesn’t work- or it doesn’t work right– or it doesn’t work as easy as it should. That’s why some top name plates have fallen to near the bottom of the customer satisfaction surveys, technology issues.

Now comes a study by the market research firm MORPACE here in greater Detroit. Finding, people will pay more for fuel efficiency..reliability eco-friendly products..but less than a third would be willing to pay more for new technology in their next vehicle.

So the car makers put tons of money into hi-tech– the consumer is not following the playbook. Let me throw something else into the mix. Some of that technology knows where you are, so it can help you find your way, avoid traffic tie-ups and more. But if it knows where you are, it knows where you go and at least one company has toyed with the idea of selling that information to advertisers.

Does that bother anybody out there? Let me know. I do read your Autoline comments–even when they hurt!

And just a reminder before I go, make sure you tune into tonight’s episode of Autoline After Hours from LA. John will be joined by his fellow NACTOY jurors, Matt DeLorenzo and Jack Nerad of KBB to talk about the hits and misses at the auto show. As an added bonus, John will take a tour of Bruce Meyer’s Beverly Hills Garage which has a great collection of classic cars, hot rods, motorcycles and even a boat. That’s all tonight at 6PM Eastern at

But that’s it for today’s show. Once again I’m Murray Feldman, from FOX 2 News in Detroit thanks for watching and have a great day.

Thanks to our Partners for embedding Autoline Daily on their websites: Autoblog and

88 Comments to “AD #1263 – 2015 Subaru WRX, Kia Introduces 1st Rear-Drive Sedan, Honda’s Wild FCEV Concept”

  1. HtG Says:

    Info tech

    It was interesting to hear Mark Reuss say that CUE was now much more quick to respond. Isn’t lagginess one of peoples’ generic complaints? Once you start getting LTE involved there’s a whole new dimension like network latency. Maybe oldsters will be less accepting of the modern challenges, but if it will get people(looking at you ladies) to drop their phones, I’ll suffer more intrusions.

    As far as being watched, I thought that was the point. How else will I know where the closest McD’s is?

    Commenter note; we’re lovin’ you here in NY, Murray. Hammer down, landesman.

  2. Kit Gerhart Says:

    It nice that automakers are working on fuel cells, but I’m not sure what the point is, when there is no fuel for them. I guess that might change when there are unlimited quantities of free electricity to produce hydrogen by electrolyzing water. I’m not holding my breath, though.

  3. drew Says:

    If anyone is paying attention to the parallel universe, cable TV is losing subscibers. Why? People don’t want to pay for more than they want (too many channels) and the original benefit of cable TV (no commercials) is gone. And don’t get me going about having to pay extra for HD.

    Infotainment needs to learn. I suspect most people will not tolerate advertising in their vehicle, and I’ll bet NHTSA will want to regulate such things as “distraction”. Most of the quality ills of today’s infotainment systems can addressed via simplification. Sometimes “less” yields higher value.

  4. Kit Gerhart Says:

    It’s great to hear that car buyers might be more interested in things like gas mileage and reliability, you know, things pertaining to the actual functioning of a vehicle, than in more electronic gadgets. I hope the car companies will take note of it.

  5. G.A.Branigan Says:

    “Less is more”…an old but true adage. Tracking peoples movements even in a vehicle,to me is very disturbing,and I don’t like it.Add to that commercials while driving? Where will it end? Answer:when people stop opting for those options is when,imho.

  6. HtG Says:

    I’m increasingly viewing cars as one important node in the sensor mediated computational network. The current thrust in computers is going to fill the world with sensors that will directly communicate with more efficient servers, whether through cellular or wifi. This will generate gobillions of bits of data. Somehow, cars will fit into this new landscape, more so than the other way around. Adjusting your AC will be only a miniscule part of operating a car, if you ask me. And if you did ask me, I’d say I’m holding on to my simple Civic as long as I can(even as I link my phone to my aftermarket stereo, because really, radio and ads?).

  7. kurtw Says:

    Nicely presented show, and yes, it bothers me that vehicles with advanced electronics can not only record where you have been, but have that info sold to advertisers. It’s reason I leave most of my vehicle’s “advanced” electronics turned off – who needs more ads flashed in their face?

  8. Chuck Grenci Says:

    Looks like GM got it right, at least in design of the EV1; Honda and V-dub look seriously alike the original from the boys from Michigan.

    So if the Federal government dropping the electric support for the fuel cell; kind of the way ‘they’ work, spend a bunch, let the progress gained, wain, the go somewhere else to spend some more money.

    Murray, right on (with your editorial comment today); get the basics right (first) then the ‘cloud’ can be the ‘candy’ of the car. And the selling of consumer info; breach of privacy (big time) IMO

  9. pedro fernandez Says:

    Kia K900 Now Kia is gonna enter the alphanumeric little game that other luxury brands are using, do they think that people will automatically consider them a luxo car maker by doing this? they are loco!!

  10. HtG Says:

    Do people “get” that their cellphone can monitor them at all times? That thing isn’t ever off, as in off off, unless you take out the batter(I think). That’s right, Vasili and Lei Ming can rate your performances, shall we say.

  11. pedro fernandez Says:

    Hell no, bad enough I leave oil drops wherever I go, I certainly don’t need no electronic gizmo telling the world where I am or have been. I prefer to be “disconnected” thanks, anyway.

  12. pedro fernandez Says:

    HtG that is why I won’t get rid of my “stupid” cheapo phone while everyone looks at me like I came here in a time machine, I don’t want no stinkin’ smarty pants phone.

  13. HtG Says:

    Pedro, people think you’re dealing meth, or insider trading. It’s a good look these days.

  14. Brett Says:

    Autoline TV refers to the Kia K900 as cousin to the Hyundai Equus. refers the Kia K900 as cousin to the Hyundai Genesis.

    Who’s correct?

  15. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I like using my smart phone to read Autoline, and post while I’m waiting for breakfast at a restaurant, but the extent to which I can be “spied on” is a little scary, even though I am one of the least paranoid people I know regarding such things.

  16. pedro fernandez Says:

    Equus, Kia has no version of the Genesis

  17. Jon M Says:

    Does the idea of where I go in my vehicle being sold to advertisers bother me, you ask Murray? How emphatically can I say YES!?! This is one more problem I have with the proliferation of in-car infotainment. I found it inflammatory and outrageous that I could browse a car dealer’s lot, or stop at McD’s for a shake, and then get inundated with ads for car dealers and fast food restaurants on my so-called infotainment screen, smartphone, email, and/or every other form of medium.

  18. pedro fernandez Says:

    HtG: I’ve been looking for a Don Johnson Miami Vice era block phone, but they don’t work in today’s systems.

  19. pedro fernandez Says:

    Does this mean that smart phone users will get inundated with Pepto Bismol ads as they have dinner at a Mexican restaurant?

  20. Kit Gerhart Says:

    14, It sounds like there is a lot of incest going on there.

    Actually, they are both correct in that all three are closely related, but the K900 would be closer to the Equus. Those two are the “stretch” version of the Genesis.

  21. pedro fernandez Says:

    Or better still, divorce lawyer ads as they sit at a strip joint?

  22. Kit Gerhart Says:

    …and I can’t even take the battery out of my present phone.

  23. pedro fernandez Says:

    #20 Kit I did not know that! so the Genesis coupe and sedan are two completely different vehicles?

  24. Kit Gerhart Says:

    23, Yeah, the coupe and sedan are a lot different. I’m sure they share some parts, but the coupe is shorter wheelbase, uses mostly different power trains, and the interiors is substantially different. Also, the price is a lot different. A “base” Genesis couple is about $25K MSRP, if such cars exist, while the sedan is at least 10K more.

  25. Fred Battle Says:

    The placement of electronic distracting devices and gimmicks in the front dash area is a blatant attempt to sell a car not on function as a transport vehicle but as a parlor for games. This can not add any safety to the vehicle like air bags or engineered crush zones but will enhance the need for all of the above to protect the distracted driver. Now you can read text messages from the dash! Better lawyer up! Fred

  26. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Pedro, I just saw your last comment for yesterday’s how about CVT’s. Is it mostly Nissan CVT’s the shop guy was talking about? They probably make up 80% of the CVT’s in the U.S., not counting the Toyota and Ford hybrids, which are something completely different, and are mechanically very simple.

  27. Bradley Says:


    Yes, the EV1 was a terrific car/concept. The issue is why did GM pull them off the market and destroy the inventory? There are a few conspiracy theories..
    1. GM became afraid of pioneering a future of simple low maintenance vehicles.
    2. GM received BIG money from BIG oil to walk away.

    GM gets points for even creating the EV1, but they receive far more negative points for pulling the car off the market as they did.

  28. pedro fernandez Says:

    H/K seems to have adopted the stretched wheelbase strategy to get two completely different vehicles from the same platform, Sonata>Azera Optima>Cadenza. Surprised did not do Accent>Elantra as well.

  29. Bradley Says:

    Its all about the MPG and reliability.

    As the American middle class continues to erode away, people are paying more attention to “total cost of ownership.”

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I suspect they pulled the EV1 off the market because they weren’t prepared to support them long-term. They never sold them, only leased them.

    They were impressive, especially considering how well they worked with lead-acid batteries. If you made the same car with lithium batteries, filling the back seat area with them, as they did with the lead-acid batteries, the car would have serious range, probably 300-400 miles.

  31. ColoradoKid Says:

    Honda FCEV

    Plan on it folks . Fuel Cells and Hydrogen ICE’s ……. ARE the wave of the not too distant future . With EV’s Hybrids and possibly even diesels ( except in trucks ) to fall by the wayside . And you can take that … to the bank mien freunds .


    Mercedes GLA 45 – It aint no concept baby … its a bona fide on its way here and I may even have one on reserve …. FACT !

    The CLA-45′s been such a runaway success there was no way Mercedes couldn’t do a GLA-45 as well ..


    WHAT ??? Still no Subaru Cross Sport ? The shining star of the late season auto shows .. and the one and only car of late that might get me out of a Mercedes ? For shame !


    #6 – WTF ?


    BTW … I like to use my Smartphone … for …. hmmn … gee …. I dunno …. making and receiving …. err … Phone Calls ;-)


    Drew – +1

  32. ColoradoKid Says:

    Bradley – 26 – Or even more likely …. All of the above …. with a little behind the scenes double dealing and under the tables you haven’t heard about as well

  33. ColoradoKid Says:

    Bradley – 28

    Or … even more likely … as the American Middle Class disappears off into the sunset .. they won’t have the cash or credit to buy any new cars …. period .

    Funny how those in the Upper and Stratospheric classes haven’t yet come to grips yet with the fact that …. as the Middle Class goes .. so do they … seeing as how their wealth is for the most part derived from the Middle Class

    Oh well … as I’ve always said …. Money’s no guarantee of Class , Taste , Wisdom or Knowledge . Which is to say …. just cause you’ve got the degree is no guarantee you understand any of it

  34. WineGeek Says:

    I agree that the possibility of where I go being “sold” without my permission has been a pet peeve of mine on all of the technology platforms. I use most of the current technology and I am an early adopter, but the information being sold makes me mad. I wouldn’t agree with that ever, and why should I allow that is beyond my comprehension. I believe that it is an invasion of privacy and I would get and old transistor radio and put it on my dashboard to avoid this happening! (does anyone remember what transistor was?)

  35. Kit Gerhart Says:

    “Mercedes GLA 45 – It aint no concept baby … its a bona fide on its way here and I may even have one on reserve …. FACT !”

    Hmm… You are considering that very highly boosted TURBO?? I assume you would lease it, though, and not buy it, which would be a good plan.

  36. Kit Gerhart Says:

    As far as the EV1, there are still a lot of conspiracy theories going about, but I worked at GM at the time, and my division was heavily involved with developing some of the electronics. GM just didn’t want to support them when things started going wrong as they got old, and very low volume parts were needed. That’s pretty much the story.

  37. Kit Gerhart Says:

    30, If you use your smart phone only for making phone calls, why do you have a smart phone? Just curious. A basic flip phone works as well as, or better than most smart phones for basic phone calls.

  38. Bradley Says:


    From all the information I have seen, the cars were reliable, and the owners were in love with them.

    If GM didn’t have a long term plan, then what did they want to gain from it? They couldn’t have recovered their investment yet?

    If your perception of events reflects the true reality; it makes GM seem even more disorganized and fly-by-night idea driven that it already does.

  39. pedro fernandez Says:

    An actual keypad is a must for me, virtual ones, I will never get used to those, hopefully they will never stop making those kinds of phones.

  40. Lex Says:


    I agree with you the fact that someone is thinking or able to sell information of our comings and goings should be very scary to all of us and our familys. The Burglers can buy this information and break into your home while you are out at work or on vacation. Big Brother is watching but not very Tom, Dick or Harry should have access to this information. GM provided OnStar data to the federal government to track where people when after Katrina hit New Orleans.

    This whole automonous car technology is going to errode our driving freedom. Government Agencies will be able to track your every movement. Automotive manufacturers will charge more for this technology and make automobile ownership too expensive and a thing of the past. If predictions are correct and one day the earth is hit with a huge solar flare / EM pulse and the whole electronic / power grid fails what will happen to all those interconnected signals which keep those automonous vehicles from crashing into one another? We will be enslaved by the greedy producers of these technologies – food for thought.

  41. pedro fernandez Says:

    From CR on Youtube today: 99% of all Tesla owners surveyed by them were very happy with their cars, but the one thing that was not revealed is: how many people actually were included in this survey, after all it is an extremely low volume vehicle, for all you know it was 2 or 3 only.

  42. G.A.Branigan Says:

    ” I still don’t need any steeekin’ smart phone”…

    Bluetooth: I used to have a sun visor mounted bluetooth for my phone….it is now in my wifes CRV.Under a hundred bux,and works better then the built in bluetooth in my nox.That’s because the nox is set up for smartphones.

    GPS: A garmin on the dash does just as good as a 2k$ nav option,for under 200 bux,and it doesn’t give a crap where you go.Jmho…

  43. pedro fernandez Says:

    plus smart phones also have GPS, my son and his friends traveled last year up to Chicago and that little gadget was great for reservations, navigation and even helped find public restrooms.

  44. G.A.Branigan Says:

    @ pedro: Yeah,that’s where they track ya,on them smartphones.

  45. Bradley Says:

    Overall We are worse than the horror 1984 created to its readers in 1949. OMG, WTF, all could be argued as “new speak.”

    However, the horror isn’t as bad now, because we got there through incremental steps. Plus, we have received some benefit from having cameras, GPS and data mining everywhere.

    The issue I have is if a car company is making money of my data. If the government uses the information to favor business or control the populous, this would be bad.

  46. G.A.Branigan Says:

    I don’t like ANY intrusion on my privacy,period.It is unconstitutional and damn sure isn’t necessary.

  47. HtG Says:

    Oh you better believe govts are looking for data to help their own industry. You think US trade reps go into negotiations without being served by the relevant agency?

    Noticing CK is a little quiet today. ;)

  48. HtG Says:

    Privacy is face to face, no phones, outside with no one around. But really, for most of us no one wants to hear anything we think or say. It’s noise.

  49. George Ricci Says:

    Hydrogen powered cars sound great, zero emission. Wrong, where did you get the hydrogen? 99% of all the hydrogen made is the US is made by burning natural gas, a fossil fuel. So it has a carbon footprint and is not zero emission. Also, the process of converting natural gas to hydrogen is only 78% efficient and then you lose another 10% by compressing it to 5000 psi so you can get enough into a fuel tank to go somewhere.

  50. G.A.Branigan Says:

    @ HtG: He’s been quiet for a couple of weeks now.Noise,I still hear the high pitched whinning of a jet turbine and main rotor trans.Some days it get’s really loud,then I can’t even understand what people are saying to me.

  51. G.A.Branigan Says:

    @ 49: As CK likes to say,”there’s no free lunch”.However,it’s been my observation that most ‘greenies’ don’t see it that way.Weird to say the least….

  52. Brett Says:


    I believe I was saying that two different news sources say that the Kia K900 was a cousin to both the Hyundai Equus and the Hyundai Genesis.

    Your answer makes no sense.

    From a price/powertrain/size perspective it seems to be a lot closer to the Genesis, IMO.

  53. pedro fernandez Says:

    The K99 is built on the same platform as the Equus which is a stretched version of the Genesis sedan, so in what respect was I wrong?

  54. HtG Says:

    I guess I don’t know why an automobile should be any less intrusive than the other gadgets in our modern lives. Especially since the roads are publicly owned and driving is a privilege.

    I think I just aged a bit after writing that.

  55. ColoradoKid Says:

    37 – Ahem … think about that one for a minute …… ;-)


    Lex – Oh dear … if only you knew the half of it ….. cause its so much worse than you can even imagine . Sometime I’ll put up the tale of SG and I catching some kiddies ( teens ) red handed with an entire iPad of illegal ( hacked ) Apps … titled …. Mercedes Benz Unlock – Acura Unlock – Ford Unlock – Cadillac Unlock – BMW Unlock etc etc … and yes … they all worked frighteningly well I might add


    51 How right you is good sir ! No Free Lunch indeed . But……… the simple fact is once all the magic under wraps is made public you’ll be seeing that Hydrogens costs will be much lower .. easier to absorb and with fewer ramifications than anything else available .

    No fears though G.A. .. trucks’ll always have the diesel option … theys jest some things diesel can’t be topped in

    The BIG question [ the only one in fact ] with hydrogen being … will the Evil Empire ( big oil ) let the hydrogen cat get out of the bag …. despite them being in the catbirds seat to profit from it .. we’ll see

    And heck G.A. ( and HtG ) I didn’t know you cared …. blush ..

    ( the CK’s been quiet of late comments )


    HtG – 54 – We’re all aging … way too much and way too fast I might add …. ” Future Shock ” having become our current reality ….. but i must tell you … caring a whole lot less about things I have no control over sure has been a release … not to mention less migraines etc … hence my having gone a bit more quiet of late

  56. ColoradoKid Says:

    Thursday Afternoon Video break

    ( jess cause some of ya’s actually missed me )

    A little Lancia 037 – Walter Rohrl – and a few classic San Remo stages from the good(bad) ole Group B days

    Whats not to love ?

    ( caveat ; its in German but it really doesn’t matter )

  57. Kit Gerhart Says:

    At the time, GM said part of the reason for the EV1 was to test new technologies, like induction motors run over a wide speed range, and the electronics to control them. Also, it was probably the first use of electric A/C in a car, and some other technologies that have become commonplace.

    Yeah, there wasn’t a long-term plan, unless the plan was to make them a few years, and then discontinue the car. I’m sure GM lost a lot of money with the program, but they learned some things. Also, they proved that an electric car could serve as real transportation in an age of 80 mph freeway travel, albeit with limited range.

  58. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Exactly. Until we have electricity from renewable sources to electrolyze water, there will be no environmentally sound source of hydrogen. Even then, it takes a large amount of space to store enough hydrogen to run a car very long.

  59. Dan Clemons Says:

    Hi Murray:

    No, I do not want my incar information sold to anyone. We have given up enough personal privacy as it is.

    Thank for sitting in for John. We appreciate it.


  60. G.A.Branigan Says:

    And then there is the infrastructure for hydrogen,which of course,is lacking.Will gas stations put that in place on their dime,or big oil? My guess would be big oil of course,on OUR dime ;}>

  61. HtG Says:

    GA, I think that yesterday someone from Hyundai was talking to John about California setting up hydrogen stations. But I liked Murray’s point that you’d need to live close to a station. If I lived in LA I’d drive that car; if only it shouted out to the world how admirable I am. I suppose one advantage of hydro is that the has pipes are already in place and the US isn’t running out of frackers anytime soon.

  62. HtG Says:

    “…gas pipes….” Sorry, autocorrect strikes again

  63. ColoradoKid Says:

    58 – Actually … they’re 98% already there ..


    60- Heres the kicker with Hydrogen that most do not know . Everything …. from Refineries – to gas stations – right down to the guy down the streets 32 Deuce Ardun Flat Head hot rod … are all easily … and cheaply ( once the technology is in manufacture ) to convert

    Which is to say … with a tweak here … a mod there … a little add on or two …. ALL the infrastructure is and has been in place … for years [ which is why Big Oil ... assuming they play their cards right stand to make a Second Coming of sorts .. and make even more money than ever ]

    So …. in love wiff that ole 63 T-Bird / 50′s Jeepster / 66 Land Cruiser ? Not wanting a new car .. but choosing to be a little more responsible ?

    No problem … none what so ever . Best cost estimate to convert … under a $1,000

    Hydrogen …. its the Future … and everybody … from BWW-Toyota – Mercedes – Honda – VW Audi etc knows it … assuming once again …. those folks in Big Oil are capable of seeing beyond their own noses and chose to benefit rather than block the Hydrogen Future

  64. pedro fernandez Says:

    Lest anyone forgets. This planet will run out of fossil fuels in about 50 yrs.

  65. HtG Says:

    Here’s a thought(it happens). What if there were a fleet of hydro cars managed by Zipcars, and people could get a state subsidy to drive them if they drove their ICE cars less? Who knows what governor moonshot will do?

  66. ColoradoKid Says:

    Dan Clemons

    Hate to be the bearer of bad news …. but …. errr … your in car infotainment etc is already being sold/stolen/borrowed etc on a regular basis … along with everything else private you may hold dear

    Simple fact is …. you and I are no longer the customer .. we’re now the information commodity .. to be sold to the highest bidder

  67. HtG Says:

    63 I read that the energy majors are getting into the fracking game. And as they say, money’s green. If hydro is gas….

  68. ColoradoKid Says:

    65 – Hows about effing the subsidy and simply charging a reasonable enough price that you’d almost have to be crazy not to take them up on the offer ?

    Seriously …. I’d bet with proper management ( oh now theres a scary thought ) they could do it profitably

    Especially …. NOW …. that Gordon Murray and Yamaha have teamed up to build his magnificent little city car …

  69. ColoradoKid Says:


    Fracking = Old School thinking

    Think back to the days of Kerosene vs Petroleum

    The horse to bet on being the horse with its nose pointed towards the future … rather than still looking back at a past soon to be no more

  70. ColoradoKid Says:

    68 ……. and when you consider the Middle Classes rapidly diminishing bank accounts … yet still needing cars due to the geography of the land and the layout of our towns/cities/rural and lack of public ( read trains and trolleys ) ….

    .. well …. that just might be a possible answer to the question nobody right now has the cojones to ask

  71. HtG Says:

    69 I don’t understand CK, gas is the feed stock for hydro.

  72. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Any spark ignition engine can be set up to run on hydrogen, but it will take a trunk filled with 5000 psi tanks to carry enough to run a car 250 miles. It won’t be cheap, and the equipment to “fill up” won’t be cheap either.

  73. HtG Says:

    Kit, do you anything about how long hydrogen will sit in a tank before it evaporates away?

  74. drew Says:

    So, who is loooking forward to the Big Data future wherein the insurance companies dynamically change your rate premiums depending where you drove today and your driving style?!?!?! Think – Progressive Snap Shot on steroids… and involuntary.

  75. T. Bejma Says:

    Back in 2005 some (even MotorTrend) thought we would have Hydrogen vehicles in 2010 and that it would cost less than $1,000 (or even down to $130) to convert…

    You can see how well that turned out…

  76. T. Bejma Says:

    Sorry Ben, forgot about the 2 link rule…

    Back in 2005 some (even MotorTrend) thought we would have Hydrogen vehicles in 2010 and that it would cost less than $1,000 (or even down to $130) to convert…

  77. T. Bejma Says:

    You can see how well that turned out…

  78. pedro fernandez Says:

    Motor Trend has always been full of it, just look at some of their past car of the year winners.

  79. Kit Gerhart Says:

    If it’s pressurized to high pressure, but not liquified, it would last indefinitely. If it is liquified, and is at atmospheric pressure and very cold, it would boil off, probably in a few days, depending on how good the “thermos bottle” tank is.

  80. Kit Gerhart Says:

    77, like Vega?

  81. T. Bejma Says:

    Chinese not feeling the PSA deal as much anymore…

  82. pedro fernandez Says:

    Well, Kit in all honesty, just like the X-cars that followed, the Vega looked good on paper and the car itself, was not bad, it was the engine that killed it. I remember when we went to buy the Chevette, the sales man went out of his way to assure us that it did not have the Vega engine, as if the worst thing in the world.

  83. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The Vega engine was bad, and the car was also rust prone. The Chevette engine was ok, but that car was also rust prone. With the Indiana road salt, it was not uncommon for shock towers and floorboards to rust out in 5 years.

  84. pedro fernandez Says:

    So were the Japanese cars back then, but you gotta remember, folks in Japan used to replace their cars a lot sooner than here in the US, which is more incredible that they were made to last so long w/o much repairs.

  85. HtG Says:

    Such a missed opportunity with the Vega. A lightweight car designed by Cole. I hate thinking about it. My recollection of the Chevette was going for a test drive, and man what a sulfurous smell from the catalytic converter. This stuff hurts.

  86. C-Tech Says:

    Renault Alliance – Motor Trend car of the year. That’s all I’ve got to say about Motor Trend.

    Keep in mine Japan and Germany have stricter rules and annual inspections your car must pass. Many U.S. used cars would be taken off the road there.

  87. dcars Says:

    Sorry Murray, I don’t care if a million companies know my every move, because their is a millions of me. My information is just one tiny drop in an ocean full of information.

  88. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Vega, Renault Alliance, Mustang II, Citation, Aspen/Volare,

    They’ve gotten some “right” over the years, though.