AD #2477 – Waymo Set for Public Launch, GM’s Maven Expands Outside GM, Which Brands Hold Value Best?

November 13th, 2018 at 11:34am

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Runtime: 7:10

0:30 Waymo Nearly Ready for Public Launch
1:10 GM’s Maven Expands Outside the Company
1:34 ALG Hands Out Annual Pre-Owned Value Awards
2:43 Big Truck Sales Keep Going Up
3:31 Jaguar Celebrates with Rally F-TYPE
4:53 Most Powerful Non-M 3 Series Ever
5:59 ZF Tests Drone Package Delivery

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21 Comments to “AD #2477 – Waymo Set for Public Launch, GM’s Maven Expands Outside GM, Which Brands Hold Value Best?”

  1. phred Says:

    It is noteworthy that BMW still uses an inline 6 cylinder layout for the performance power plant against all the “experts” that were commenting on the inevitable disappearance of this configuration in a “Modern” performance vehicle. BMW Engineering let is success do the talking!!

  2. ChuckGrenci Says:

    The inline 6 is a naturally balanced powerplant and if space is not a concern makes for a very good platform. I don’t think many experts poo poo’d the six but they probably suggested that it has begun to lose favor (as we are starting to see of the V-8).

  3. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The main reason V-6 engines exist is that they are easy to package, both in longitudinal and transverse installations. Mercedes used them longer than most car companies, and are going to start using them again.

    Most 6 cylinder diesels used in bigger trucks are inline.

  4. Lex Says:

    If GM is willing to allow Maven to use Non-GM vehicles in it’s fleet, then why doesn’t GM Offer On-Star Subscription Services to Non-GM vehicle owners? I would think that this would be a very desirable subscription to buyers of CPO vehicles.

  5. Lambo2015 Says:

    Waymo proves what I said here months ago that the amount of money the automakers are throwing at autonomy is crazy. The tech giants and software gurus will most likely get to the finish line first and rather then spend billions developing their own specific AV hardware and software. Seems it would make more sense to wait for companies like Waymo to have a system that is proven and then partner or buy them.

  6. ChuckGrenci Says:

    Lambo, I think I’m following your reasoning; will Waymo get in on the ground floor or merely set a standard and then all the other manufacturers come in and take over. Have to wait and find out.

  7. Larry D. Says:

    Re ‘which brands hold value best’, I would like a second opinion.

    Not that I doubt Subarus are very popular (however because of their AWD their MPG sucks). However, I will only believe that… Jaguars of all luxury makes hold their value best, when I actually see the detailed data on which this UNbelievable claim is based, if any.

    In any case, Jaguar is largely IRRELEVANT in the US car market, the vast majority of JLR tiny sales in the US comes from the LAND ROVERS and NOT from the Jags, and this continues even after Jag had to introduce a so-called “SUV” (which has a really cheap Hyundai-like interior) to bolster its anemic sales.

    Even more unbelievable is that…. Nissan of all brands would earn any “award” in this area. Nissan makes cheap junk. Maybe it is because the actual new Nissan prices are so low (after discounts and incentives), that they do not go much lower from there when they depreciate? Again, only when and if I see the actual data will I believe this.

    And the bad news continues, this AAH will be about the.. Nissan Altima? I’ll have even more reason to skip the infomercial and just enjoy the discussion among the regulars.

    Re this non-M M series BMW, if it not an M, why do they pretend it is some kind of a poor relative to an M and call it M340i? I wish BMW would cut the crap on this one, AND, especially, start again using alphanumerics that provide some accurate info. It used to be that a 340 would have a 4.0 lt engine. Now the 40 in 340 means NOTHING.

    I know why BMW does this, today’s 2 lt BMWs have as much power as older 4.4 lt V8 BMWs used to have! But if they had a tradition going back decades where the 30 in 330 meant a 3 liter 6 etc, they should KEEP it, and if they want to advertise the HP, they can say “320i 350HP” or something. Lambo uses the HP to number their cars, rounding it to the next zero, but if BMW started doing this it would discontinue its long tradition.

  8. Larry D. Says:

    7 PS re how … ‘well” Jags hold their value, i remember back in the 90s when Autoweek would publish detailed reviews of a model, they also printed a depreciation graph showing how much of its value the car would lose in each of its first 5 years. Guess which flagship luxury car was the worst ever, with a truly unbelievable 72% depreciation in its FIRST year alone?

    You guessed it, it was a JAGUAR, the top model XJ 12 with the V12 engine, which sold for about $80k (in good 1990s dollars, not today’s worthless dollars too!)

  9. Kit Gerhart Says:

    7 BMW is also using the “M” but not really an M silliness with the M240, while there is also an actual M2.

    I, too, miss the actual, meaningful model designations showing engine displacement, dropped by both BMW and Mercedes. Almost worse, Lexus has a mix of model names that mean something, like LC500 and RX350 indicating engine displacement, while the current LS500 has a 3.4 liter turbo V6, and an NX300 has a 2 liter turbo four. Go figure.

  10. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Jaguar as the “premium brand holding value” must have included Land Rover. There are three LRs winning individual categories.

    Still, the whole thing sounds suspect, but I don’t have the data.

  11. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Interestingly, GM and Ford have no individual category “winners” on the list, while FCA had two, Wrangler and Charger.

  12. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Sean, regarding the ALG thing, you don’t really mean that Nissan and Mercedes had 3 awards each, do you? Looking at their site, I see zero segment winners for Nissan, while there are 5 for Subaru, 4 for Toyota and 3 for Mercedes, if you include trucks and vans. This is from ALG’s site at:

    If you were referring to something different, please let us know. Thanks.


    I too lament that BMW has lost their traditional naming structure. The M340i could easily be named 330T to signify both displacement and that it has a turbo. Do they even need an “i” in their name anymore since everything is fuel injected?

    I also hate that they have things like these M edition cars which are not an actual M car. To me these shenangians are diluting the real M brand.

  14. Lambo2015 Says:

    On brands holding their value I find these results surprising as well. I don’t find anything in the Subaru brand appealing so I have no idea how they are priced new or used. But Jaguar is extremely surprising.
    More interesting would be specific vehicles that hold their value best which I would expect to be Ford F150, Jeep Wrangler and a Lexus for luxury brand.

  15. Kit Gerhart Says:

    14 My sister has a mid-trim 2017 Subaru Forester, and the pricing is pretty good when new, which helps resale value, as a percentage of new. For that reason, Subaru makes sense. As I remember, her Forester was $28-29K MSRP, pretty well equipped with leather, sunroof, and maybe power seats.

    As far as Jaguar, I wouldn’t expect that at all, especially if it isn’t actually JLR they are talking about. still??? Maybe Range Rovers hold their value well.

    I don’t know if you checked the link I posted, but Tundra was the top big pickup, and Lexus the winning “premium executive.” There is no way of telling from their web site, but I wonder if they included Tesla. I’d think the Model S might hold its value well, against the cars they’d probably class with the LS.

  16. Kit Gerhart Says:

    15 Lexus LS was the winning “premium executive.” The LS was the only Lexus segment winner.

  17. Sean McElroy Says:

    @Kit – I’m still looking into it, but it seems as though you are looking at the Residual Value Awards and we used the Pre-Owned Value Awards. It does not look like ALG has anything up on its website yet for the POVA.

  18. Kit Gerhart Says:

    17 Thanks, Sean. I’m not sure of the difference between residual and pre-owned value, but that explains why the site I found is different from what you had for the show.

    I just found that I didn’t look at the “brands” listing of my link well enough. It has Subaru and Land Rover as the mainstream and premium brands.

  19. Kit Gerhart Says:

    Here is info on the “pre-owned value awards”

    There’s a lot of mysterious stuff there, like the orphan Nissan Quest, and the really substandard Taurus winning segment awards. Anyway, it’s interesting.

  20. GM Veteran Says:

    #4, Lex you can buy an aftermarket OnStar unit and install it in any car. They became available at Best Buy two years ago or so.

    On the residual values, I would have liked to see what vehicle claims the overall highest residual value. For the last 2-3 years, my understanding is that the Jeep Wrangler held this honor. I’m guessing that it is a supply and demand thing and not indicative of a sky high build quality.

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The ALG “pre-owned value awards” are based on depreciation of a 2 year old car bought now, and sold in 3 years. That means cars that depreciate horribly the first 2 years, but then level off, could do well in those ratings. That probably explains the Quest, Taurus, and 7 series. Of course, the Quest and Taurus have high early depreciation because they are near worst-in-class. The 7 has high early depreciation because all cars in that class have high depreciation, and some competitors, like S and LS are better received in that segment.