AD #2845 – Renault, Nissan & Mitsubishi Not Merging; BMW 5 Series Refreshed; Kia Looking Into Small Urban EV

May 27th, 2020 at 11:42am

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Listen to “AD #2845 – Renault, Nissan and Mitsubishi Not Merging; BMW 5 Series Refreshed; Kia Looking Into Small Urban EV” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 10:02

0:07 France Spending €8 Billion to Help Auto Industry
0:34 Renault, Nissan & Mitsubishi Not Merging
1:18 Tesla Discounts Its Vehicles in North America
2:03 Amazon in Talks to Buy AV Startup Zoox
2:46 Mercedes E-Class Coupe, Convertible & AMG Models Debut
4:18 BMW Reveals Refreshed 5 Series
5:30 Kia Wants Citroen Ami-Like Urban EV
6:18 Wireless Charging Could Boost EV Adoption
8:18 More E-Racing Drama
9:27 Mother Wrench Feeding Her Hatchlings

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29 Comments to “AD #2845 – Renault, Nissan & Mitsubishi Not Merging; BMW 5 Series Refreshed; Kia Looking Into Small Urban EV”

  1. MERKUR DRIVER Says:

    I wonder if the French EV incentive has caveats that you must buy a French made EV to get the full discount. The linked article did not say. I would assume so though. Otherwise they are just transferring French tax dollars to another country. Most likely Germany or the USA and not helping their countrymen at all with the French tax payer subsidized EV incentive.

  2. ChuckGrenci Says:

    1, I was thinking similar; why give away Euros to other companies not benefiting France.

  3. Lambo2015 Says:

    Just another example proving that EVs struggle to sell, on their own merits. Throwing more money to subsidize their existence.

    On the e-racing drama; I would expect a lot more aggressive driving and willingness to deliberately take out a driver. When the danger of damaging ones self or their expensive equipment is gone why not?
    They should institute a damage meter that either costs the race team money or adds lap time to provide an incentive for the drivers to race clean.

  4. Lambo2015 Says:

    3 cont- Daniel Abt’s stunt shows that their could be a lot of really good drivers out there that didn’t have the $$ to work their way up the ranks. Virtual racing could be the new way to discover talent. Like what American Idol did for singers that struggled to be discovered. EV racing could really raise the bar with undiscovered talent.

  5. Lambo2015 Says:

    Sorry e-racing not EV racing.

  6. bradley cross Says:

    The BMW interior cannot compare to Mercedes from what I saw.

    Great to see Tesla prices coming down for older models and not a big surprise as the Model-Y will be in super-demand. But I wonder without the Virus Recession if that would be the case now.

    How long before the Amazon Rivian vans are driving themselves?

  7. Wim van Acker Says:

    @John, his concern about the size of the new BMW 5 series grill: there are funny forecasts on line: https://www.pinterest.com/pin/853572935608686821/

  8. TERRY Says:

    I know the editors are proponents of electric drive, you can tell by how much they say good about them. But having a charging pad in the garage may be helpful, but isn’t going to solve range anxiety, when you want to take a long trip. With an I/C engine, you can reasonably drive 500 miles per day, and more if you want to do push it. And that allows for a couple of 10 minute gasoline stops.

    But even with a Tesla supercharger (and that’s difficult to find outside of California), it takes an hour to charge the car. And with standard chargers, it’s something in between, and closer to 12 hours than to 1 hour.

    If you have an electric car for commuting, and you want to also take trips, you either need another vehicle, or you’ll rent one.

  9. Kit Gerhart Says:

    8. Cordless charging would be a good way for lazy people to burn millions of tons of additional coal to charge their cars.

    Using the Tesla site, for a Model 3 long range, it would take 8 “supercharger” stops, for a total of 4 hours of charging, to make a trip I do twice a year between Indiana and Florida. If I stopped at the mid point of the trip, I could do the trip in my Camry with one 5 minute fuel stop. I don’t do that, though, normally doing two fuel stops.

    I don’t know if this link will work, but if so, it shows Tesla’s recommended route, and charge stations for my trip.

    https://www.tesla.com/trips#/?v=M3_2015_74&o=Kokomo,%20IN,%20USA_Kokomo%20Center%20Township%20Howard%20County@40.486427,-86.13360329999999&s=&d=Cocoa%20Beach,%20FL%2032931,%20USA_Cocoa%20Beach%20Brevard%20County%20FL@28.3200067,-80.6075513

  10. MJB Says:

    @7. What!?! You don’t like the grille on wheels? ;)

  11. MJB Says:

    @9. I pointed this out years ago (here on the forum), but wireless car charging will some day be as ubiquitous as wireless phone charging.

    I vividly recall back when my (favorite cell phone of all time) Palm Pre came out with built-in wireless charging. It was the first phone on the planet with it. There were article after article talking about how needless it was to have wireless charging… That is until enough people finally got a chance to experience the absolute convenience of it themselves.

    It’ll be the same with wireless car charging – I guarantee it.

  12. merv Says:

    Tesla owners in my part of the world,tend to buy the most expensive models,and for the most part, look freshly detailed.

  13. Kit Gerhart Says:

    11. “Ubiquitous” phone charging is horribly inefficient, making the phone get far hotter than connecting the cable, so I don’t use it, even though my GS-8 has it, and my Camry has a charge pad (and I have one at home). Wireless car charging would just scale that up a few thousand fold.

    Maybe, at some point, wireless car charging could become reasonably efficient, if you always park the car within a quarter inch of the same place, but do people really need to be that lazy, that they can’t plug in a cord? I guess so.

  14. Wim van Acker Says:

    @10: :-)

  15. Tony Gray Says:

    Is the Mercedes an inline as you stated or a V6?

  16. Kit Gerhart Says:

    15 It’s an inline.

  17. Lambo2015 Says:

    13 Anything that makes it effortless or can eliminate an extra step like remembering to plug in will go a long way towards making EVs more convenient/acceptable.
    As far as the phones go I’m pretty careful and have never even cracked a screen on my phones. However plugging and unplugging them does lend them to bent or broken pins on the phone or the cord. The teenagers in the house constantly go through charging cords. So wireless charging for them could be worth while. Yea your probably not going to wear out the connections on an EV or break/lose any cords but it sure would make it simple to just pull into the garage and go about your business always charging the car if it needs any.
    Otherwise you might come home with 70% battery figure its enough for tomorrows run, not plug it in and not have enough to do any extra running. The pad would help insure its fully charged every time you leave home. Just my 2 cents.

  18. MJB Says:

    @13. I don’t know what to tell you, Kit, but my phone (Galaxy S10e) doesn’t get hot from wireless charging. And charge time is a dead heat between wireless and plug-in.

    In fact, I’m looking at it right now as I type this sitting on the cradle, and it’s got 26 minutes to go to reach 100% from 86%. I just switched to plugging it straight into a wall adapter and got the exact same estimate of 26min.

    Maybe it’s been a while since you last tried wireless charging, but I honestly think most (if not all) of those concerns about lost energy have been engineered out (for cell phones anyway).

  19. MJB Says:

    Another shameless plug for my old Palm Pre: That inductive charger for it was also magnetic (a fantastic feature I still have yet to see replicated on any other phone since then). I kept an extra one mounted on the console in my car because it worked great for keeping my phone not just charged, but held onto it like gorilla glue from slipping off the charging pad even through hard turns and braking.

    That right there was not laziness, just SUPER convenience.

  20. RickW Says:

    @9,Kit,
    I am very surprised at the number of charging stations that could potentially be available on your trip to and from FL back to Indiana.

    I’m not going to comment on the amount of time necessary to recharge at these points along your trip route.

    But, prior to looking at the link, I thought the route you would have to take would be more Zig-Zag than what the map shows.

    Thanks for posting that Link. It was most informative to someone that has never seen a charging station.

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    18. Maybe something is different with the newer phones. If my S8 dies, or the battery loses enough capacity that it matters, I’ll probably get then-current GSx, and will find out if it gets hot with wireless charging. I occasionally use the wireless charging with my S8 in the car, but always plug it in at home.

    17. I’ve never cracked a screen, or damaged a connector or cable, but I’m, admittedly, easier on things than most people.

    19. The charging place in my Toyota is just a flat thing, and the phone moves around easily in cornering, etc. It could definitely use something to keep it from moving around. Since I normally just charge the phone at home, it is usually in a cup holder, where it stays put very well.

  22. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20. I usually take a different route than that, a little longer, but more pleasant to me. I don’t know if Tesla chargers would cover it or not. They seem to have enough superchargers, though, to do most trips that are on the interstates. You can’t be in too much of a hurry, though.

  23. Larry D. Says:

    12 This was the case where I live only before the Model 3 was available. After it was, all the new Teslas I was seeing were Model 3s, also well detailed and some may have been the top of the line versions, but plenty regular ones, and I saw less and less Ss and Xs.

    The French incentives do not prove what you think, they are an obvious reminder that over in Europe, they don’t care about the MPG as much as they care about reducing emissions, and they have made an 180 degree turn from obviously favoring dirty diesels, by keeping diesel fuel MUCH cheaper than gas (a fact I exploit by my E diesel there), but now there is an EU policy to favor EVs for the above reasons (EMissions).

    Tesla model 3 and Y, both important, huge volume sellers and NOT niche vehicles, are obviously priced the SAME as their gas competitors, but other EVs are almost twice that.

    One can check the link in case Teslas are excluded, if they are, I am sure the US govt will complain and retaliate.

  24. Larry D. Says:

    I checked the link in the title of the French $13k BEV incentive, and it does not specify if it is just for French or EU Cars or it includes all BEVS, but it did say it will start as fast as next WEEK, which, for Eurobureaucracy, is lightning fast.

  25. Larry D. Says:

    That 5 series interior was indeed VASTLY invferior to my sinilar sized E class. It looks like a damned Hyundai at twice the price. Granted, BMW always emphasized performance and handling over luxury, BUT previous 5 and 7 and even 3 series, esp from 1995 to 2003, had BOTH in spades. Pitiful.

  26. Lambo2015 Says:

    France announced in 2018 it would cease all energy production from coal fired plants by 2021. Upping the target from the original 2023 date. By April 2019 that new date was moved to 2022 and stipulated only if demand remained flat and the new EPR nuclear reactor in Flamanville; and a high-voltage power interconnector between Britain and France, were operational by then.
    Plus they are saying the plant closures will start in 2022 so sounds like they are back to the original 2023 date to be complete. So with a million new EVs will that push the date out further?

  27. Kit Gerhart Says:

    26. If they have strong incentives to charge the EVs during off-peak hours, by varying rates by time of day, a major increase in the number of EVs might not affect the plans.

  28. Larry D. Says:

    If the Euros have (for the short term) as high unemployment (probably more) than we have, this is their golden opportunity to provide jobs at moderate or low wages to develop the much needed EV infrastructure, namely more fast charging stations (and plugs per station) on the roads, and a solution to the problem of overnight charging for those who live in apartments there (quite a few) and don’t have the typical US Single Family house with garage and driveway.

    IF they fix those two, then at least for the two price competitive mass market BEVs (the model 3 and the Y, and maybe some low-priced, low-performance econobox BEV from VW and its Skoda and Seat subs, will do very well, and without any subsidy.

  29. Sean Wagner Says:

    One of the basic tenets of EU law (aka “acquis communautaire) is that no products or services will be singled out for preferment. That’s a complete no-no.