AD #3041 – Electric Wrangler Concept; Tesla Market Cap Predicted to Explode; Geely to Create Premium EV Brand

March 22nd, 2021 at 11:46am

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Listen to “AD #3041 – Electric Wrangler Concept; Tesla Market Cap Predicted to Explode; Geely to Create Premium EV Brand” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 8:23

0:08 Senators Urge Biden To Pick Date to Ban ICE Sales
0:58 Analyst Predicts Tesla Market Cap to Explode
1:46 Musk Denies Tesla’s Used for Spying
3:27 Lexus Equips Custom IS with Record Player
4:04 Jeep Shows Off Electric Wrangler Concept
5:22 Plug-In Wrangler Electric Range Falls Short of Estimates
6:19 Chip Shortage Likely to Get Worse
7:00 Geely Plans to Create Premium EV Brand

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48 Comments to “AD #3041 – Electric Wrangler Concept; Tesla Market Cap Predicted to Explode; Geely to Create Premium EV Brand”

  1. Ken Says:

    You can take the electric vehicles and shove them up where the sun don’t shine.

    ICE forever!

  2. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I remember seeing a 1956 DeSoto with a record player. They called it “highway hi fi,” and it used 16 2/3 rpm records, I think 7 inch. The option didn’t go over very well, and there were probably few records available in the correct format.

  3. Rey Says:

    That HEADLINE just made my day Cwolf ,Kit G.,Lambo and all those ICE lovers heads must be exploding, I sure would like John McElroy to invite Montana Skeptic to be a guest again, he could give his 2 cents, and while he is there invite Sandy Munro, he could comment on Teslas gaps and Paint finish and tell his opine on Teslas Mega casting machines, maybe these Dinosaurs should view ALL OF Sandys Vloggs in Youtube , his “Munro Live” vloggs are very entertaining and informative.
    Tesla is for sure not perfect and they have a lot to learn , but for sure Legacy Auto has taken notice , and and their kees are KNOCKING , Ford engineer one of the latest commenting about Teslas FSD , saying it is “Vaporware”, when they have nothing close to it, even GM SuperCruise pales in comparison as it is GEOFENCED, no driver assist program is continually updated OTA like Tesla autopilot and FSD, it would do John McElroy to find somebody with a Tesla with the FSD update and take a ride with him for a whole day and give us his opinion.

  4. Ron Paris Says:

    Sounds like Cathie Wood has been drinking WAAAYY too much Tesla Kool-aid!

  5. Rey Says:

    #1 Ken , burying ones head in the sand like an OSTRICH does not make the problem disappear, but there’s always a Nokia and Kodak moment.

  6. cwolf Says:

    go away Larry

  7. Kit Gerhart Says:

    4 That’s LarRey.

  8. Wim van Acker Says:

    Great show, AutoLine team! Very informative.

  9. Drew Says:

    Rey – I am surprised an EV revolutionary like you would mention Kodak… given the disruption that smart phones caused to the film market. If you and LD can use your ears/eyes and mouth in proper proportion, you’ll remember that the people you dis’d in “3” are consistently noting EV market sales growth will be limited by home charging infrastructure… particularly the lack of overnight fast charging at the millions of apartments and condos, not to mention the shaky state of affairs in our electric grid (capacity and remaining reliance on dirty sources). They are not anti-EV.

  10. Lambo2015 Says:

    3 So did you have anything of value to add to the comment section or just another Tesla cheerleader that loves to spout about the stock value. You obviously love Tesla and the Chinese cars yet haven’t gone as far as to buy one. Kind of sends a mixed signal. lol
    Just another youngin with lots to learn.

    So what happens when you take the electric Wrangler into 31″ deep water?

  11. Kevin A Says:

    There has never been any reason to ban ICE. If EVs get good enough, ICE will go away on it’s own, like steam cars did. Part of that of course will include raising the price of gasoline to reflect CO2 cleanup costs if CO2 cleanup ever starts. Also, where is the road tax going to come from when there are not ICEs. Is there going to be a tax on home electricity when that is where you charge your car? Asking for a friend.

  12. George Ricci Says:

    You know, you really have to love politicians. They want to make a splashy announcement, so they pull a date out of their rear end and put it into law. Where is the detail plan on how to get there by that date? There isn’t one. Where is the money? Well since there is no plan, no one knows if it is even feasible to get there by the date, no one knows how much it will cost, and so there is no money. Prices keep going up much faster than inflation. More and more people get priced out and can not pay, so we setup a program to subsides them. So you know who pays, its you and me and our children.

    California has a long history of making unrealistic EV sales requirements and then having to walk them back because they could not be met. Diane Feinstein and Alex Padilla should drink Kool-aid.

  13. ChuckGrenci Says:

    2%, still 2%; it’s going to be a while. BEV’s are now available (multiple manufacturers) but still not the beginning of any exponential growth. Whatever comes will come, but how does that saying go: something about “molasses in January”. In the end it will be market driven.

  14. Kit Gerhart Says:

    11 Several US states already have an EV “surcharge” which, in a number of cases, amounts to more than the average ICE user would pay in state gas tax. I would hope that, when there are more EVs on the road, systems will be enacted to measure the number of miles driven. There would be a number of ways to do that, but they wouldn’t be completely “cheat proof.”

  15. wmb Says:

    With Geely looking to start an up market EV brand (isn’t Volvo and Polstar up market?), I wonder if they would consider buying Jaguar? Jaguar is going all EV all the time and they wouldn’t have the work of starting an all new brand, there saving a great deal of money. With the market turning to SUV’s and CUV’s, doing more Jaguar crossovers at JLR, could/would eventually have them butting heads with Land Rover. At Geely, however, they woukd be free to embrace that type of vehicle without restriction. With the latest announcements from Jaguar, it looks like they will be a much smaller brand with fewer products and, IMHO, it seems that they are just preparing the marque to be sold, with all of the mix messaging they have been sending.

  16. MERKUR DRIVER Says:

    Oh good lord. The TESLA bots are at it again. Time to mute ALD for a while until this is sorted.

  17. Kit Gerhart Says:

    12 Without California’s leadership, cars might still have tubes venting crankcase smoke from the underside of cars.

    I agree, though, that they have made some unrealistic rules they’ve had to back down on, banning ICE sales in 2035 might be another one, but they’ve also forced some much need changes that have been adopted nationally, and globally, like serious emission controls.

  18. Rey Says:

    #9 drew, batteries are improving as we speak, today we use technology and super computers to do R&D and do virtual forecasting on their lifespan and other things, it might take a few years to get there , but rest assured that improvements come, just a few yrs ago we thought we’d never see a $6000 battery pack as the Tesla mod S packs cost around $15,000-$20,000, in my neighborhood and new Apartments and Condos now have Chargepoints, many Walmarts and Whole Foods have chargers too, Hydrogen is DOA asthe infrastructure, will never scale and be funded, Toyota can’t even sell their FOOLCELLS and lowered the lease by $20,000,So that leaves us with BEVs and many are fine with that, Hybrids and PHEVs are a stepping stone to BEVs but will soon die , notice GM killed the Volt , which was not a bad car, but had the wrong body, but GM it looks like will go BEV en eventually, I think they realize that having two powertrains are DUMB. Getting to BEV from ICE is going to be a long road for Detroit, VW might have a better chance, Dealers are often going to be the stumbling block, maybe that is one reason Starups like Lucid and Rivian are sometimes more valued than GM and Ford
    OH Sean has to correct his statement Cathy was right and dead on about TSLA the price was correct because the if you take into account for Presp,it the price is dead on, Today TSLA is trying @ $ 680-$ 690, the stock will be $1000-$1200 in one year, please clip this, PASTE IN YOUR MIRROR, and we will revisit next year, OK?

  19. Drew Says:

    @18 – VW’s head first dive into EVs is not purely the result of their vision for the future, but a survival agreement with all the government entities… that being agreements to spend $billions on EVs in lieu of $ billions on diesel emission cheating fines. Yes, some fines were paid monetarily, but much was negotiated as EV investment.

    With regard to Tesla’s future stock value, please remember their profits are presently coming from selling emission credits. As more OEM build their own EVs, they won’t be knocking on Tesla’s door for credits.

    Can FSD subscription pick up the gap? Time will tell. For me, I abhor Elon’s business practice of using his customers and the rest of society as his beta testers (guinea pigs)… in his zeal to bring immature technology to market. It is irresponsible.

  20. John Says:

    I worked in the environmental field for years. When it came to transportation we all felt that a transition away from ICE would occur naturally due to development and infrastructure. Banning is an artificial target that sets a bar, nothing more, nothing less. We’ll have mixed power sources for decades to come, but in any case, we’ll get to a cleaner future. As in the past, politics and practical inroads will each have their place. We have both ICE and BEV’s in our garage and each have their pluses and minuses.

  21. Drew Says:

    @20 – Well said.

  22. ArtG Says:

    Rey. Is that you, LD? And I don’t mean Larry David.

  23. Lambo2015 Says:

    So here is my take on the transition to EVs at least in the US.
    According to Google a new nuclear plant can take 5-15 years to build and a hydro-electric plant takes 4-7 years from project notification to the government to completion. So we need about 9 years to get a few more electrical plants built and another 10 years to upgrade the transmission lines and power grid. By that time charging stations should be more widely available and at least new homes will have at a minimum 200amp service. Yet millions of homes in America will still need upgrades and new electrical panels to handle charging a couple EVs. Because most every home has two or more cars so you cant just have capacity to charge a single EV. You will likely need to charge at least two cars and possibly at the same time.

    So even if everyone today started to work towards electrifying America’s automobiles we are about 20-25 years away from being able to support that effort. so 2040 or 2045 at the earliest and not everyone is on-board now so it will push it out even further. IMO.
    So companies can try and push EVs and governments can try and regulate and restrict ICEs out of existence but without a plan to support the technology it wont happen as rapidly as they think.

  24. GM Veteran Says:

    The revenue projections for Full Self Driving seem severely overinflated to me. Many people use their EVs for commuting. How many are going to want to pay a hefty monthly fee so the car can drive itself – while you monitor it. That isn’t full self-driving. The revenue projection for monthly subscriptions Sean mentioned were nearly the same as the revenue from new vehicle sales. That doesn’t really pencil when the cars are $45k and up.

  25. GM Veteran Says:

    22 – Good thinking Lambo. In addition, current vehicle production and sales are roughly 15-17 million per year in the US. At that rate, even if they all become EV sales, it will take 20 years plus to turn over the national fleet of vehicles which currently hangs around 300 million. During that transition timeframe we should be able to ramp up more power generating capacity, upgrade the grid to handle it, and upgrade home charging and public charging as needed.

  26. XA351GT Says:

    All a ban on new ICE vehicles means is people will hold on to older dirtier vehicles longer. EV isn’t the be all end all for everyone. Unless they plan on putting charging stations on every street like parking meters . What do they expect people that live in apartments or only have on street parking to do for charging ?

  27. GM Veteran Says:

    The other reason Tesla will never reach that stock price prediction is . . . competition. Right now, there are few EV choices as good as Tesla. In two years, there will be many, and from a wide variety of established brands. When other good choices are available, Tesla sales will suffer. And the Semi and the CyberTruck won’t change those prospects. Be prepared for an emergency restyling of the CyberTruck and a name change to address the rapid falloff in sales after the rabid Tesla fans have snapped up the initial production.

  28. Norm T Says:

    Lexus is focusing on phonographs and Jeep brings us plug-in hybrids…

  29. Rey Says:

    # 22, lambo just read headline today , Iowa is closing it only nuclear plant and installing Solar Field in p,ace , looks like the damage in 2018 would cost too much to repair and it is old read it today in Electrek, the future is microgrids and virtual powerplants, Tesla powerwalls Megapacks as used in S Australia’s Hornsby Megapack installation, Google can help SCHOOL YOU, It is OK to hate, but the world is moving on slowly, sometimes in Elon time, sometimes with the “Speed of Thought”> Sandy Munro.call me a Fanboi , its

  30. Rey Says:

    # 22, lambo just read headline today , Iowa is closing it only nuclear plant and installing Solar Field in p,ace , looks like the damage in 2018 would cost too much to repair and it is old read it today in Electrek, the future is microgrids and virtual powerplants, Tesla powerwalls Megapacks as used in S Australia’s Hornsby Megapack installation, Google can help SCHOOL YOU, It is OK to hate, but the world is moving on slowly, sometimes in Elon time, sometimes with the “Speed of Thought”> Sandy Munro.call me a Fanboi , its

  31. George Ricci Says:

    17. Kit, you totally misunderstand my position. I believe in reducing emissions and climate change, but we need to do it at pace where we are not pushing people into poverty or homelessness. Lets face it, all the people making these decisions are not living pay check to check.

    If we use California as an example of the future, you will find some of the highest income taxes in the nation, some of the highest sales taxes, the highest gas taxes, electricity costing twice as much as the rest of the country, some of the highest DMV fees, major companies are leaving, and more and more people becoming homeless.

  32. Kit Gerhart Says:

    22 The fastest growing electricity generating sector in the US is renewable, wind and solar. That’s great, but to be a true replacement for other sources, there needs to be storage. That could amount to a lot of gigawatt hours, or terawatt hours of batteries to make wind and solar power true replacements for other power sources.

    As far as in-home charging, for the ~70-75% of Americans living in houses, it wouldn’t take much for a “commuter” car for most people. The average commute is about 30 miles total per day. If your car will be at home for 12 hours a day, likely for most people, you can get about 50 miles of charge with a plain old 120 volt outlet. That outlet is already there in most garages. Yeah, if your car is away from home most of the time, if you drive a lot, etc., you’d need a 240 volt outlet, or a high rate DC charger for extreme cases.

  33. GM Veteran Says:

    What happened to using periods in punctuation?

    I think the future power system in our country will be more diversified than it is now and will produce power in a variety of ways best suited to geographical areas, including solar, wind, hydro, natural gas, nuclear and for a while yet, coal. No “one size fits all” solution.

    I don’t think Elon has all of the answers. But there are consortiums working on this problem with representatives from all industries concerned, to make sure the solution will be viable and will provide for our needs for the next 100 years.

  34. Kit Gerhart Says:

    31 I agree. We need a national approach to certain things, but that seems hard to come by. Yeah, California is hurting themselves in certain ways in going overboard in their efforts to “lead.”

  35. Tuck&Ro Says:

    Stop the insanity. Make the bad man stop. Banning ICE? More liberal lunacy. There is no way the infrastructure will ever catch up. Nor can America afford it. What does it take to slap you EV huggers awake? And climate change? Another hoax foisted upon America alone. When will the rest of the world comply? Never.

  36. Lambo2015 Says:

    30 That doesn’t surprise me as regulations have just about killed nuclear power. The plants take 10 to 20 years to become profitable and typically only licenced for 30 years. They have become a bad investment.

    Not sure why your so arrogant but that’s why people assume your LaRRey. He also capitalized words like you do and talked to everyone like they need schooled.. You’ll find many well versed folks here in a variety of subjects other than just Tesla that probably have forgotten more than you’ll ever know. I little humility can go a long way.

  37. Kit Gerhart Says:

    28 Lexus is going after the nostalgia market with the phonograph, to be like a ’56 DeSoto. I think it was available, briefly, in all Chrysler cars, but was expensive, unreliable, and the only titles offered were Columbia, and not all of their stuff.

    36 As a kid in the 1950s, I remember reading in Popular Science or similar magazines how nuclear power would become so cheap that they’d just run the wires to all of the houses and businesses, and wouldn’t bother to meter the power. It didn’t work out that way.

  38. Wim van Acker Says:

    @23: that makes a lot of practical sense to me, well put.

  39. Wim van Acker Says:

    @35: “And climate change? Another hoax foisted upon America alone. When will the rest of the world comply? Never.” Upon America alone? Everybody but the U.S. is working on this under the Paris Climate Change Agreement.

    A fundamental issue which has to be agreed upon is the developing world, among which the main players China and India. Since 80% of the cumulative CO2 emissions have been caused by the Western industrialized nations plus Japan, the developing countries’ argument is that we have to cut them some slack, along the lines of “you have built your wealth through 140 years of carbon emissions, and it would be unfair if we would be denied the opportunity to build a certain level of prosperity before we curb our CO2 emissions.”

    A highly complex issue to be resolved, especially in light of the huge population sizes of China, India, Indonesia (270 MM), Pakistan (230 MM) and Nigeria (200 MM).

  40. Kit Gerhart Says:

    32 should reference 23, not 22. The numbers changed while I was typing.

  41. Wim van Acker Says:

    @40: moving targets :-)

  42. Kit Gerhart Says:

    41 Yeah, they move sometimes.

    39 Great post. Definitely a complex issue with China, India, and the other countries you mentioned with huge populations. China’s electricity usage about doubled between 2008 and 2019, with the growth in industry, increased use of air conditioning, etc., and for now, a lot of it is produced by burning coal.

  43. Wim van Acker Says:

    @42: exactly. They have had years of 6-8% annual GDP growth, so the doubling of electricity usage is in line with that. One of teh fundamental questions is how much economic development is fair? Measured in which dimension? In GDP growth achieved, in GDP per capita, in a number of years of runway, etc.? And how to determine these levels for China, India, Indonesia, etc., which have all different situations and levels of prosperity? As I mentioned earlier, these are hugely complex international issues with have to be resolved. We need highly qualified and knowledgeable negotiators on our behalf, and IMHO the current U.S. Special Presidential Envoy for Climate is not that.

  44. Wim van Acker Says:

    @43 I will try once more without typos

    @42: exactly. They have had years of 6-8% annual GDP growth, so the doubling of electricity usage is in line with that. One of the fundamental questions is how much economic development is fair? Measured in which dimension? In GDP growth achieved, in GDP per capita, in a number of years of runway, etc.? And how to determine these levels for China, India, Indonesia, etc., which have all different situations and levels of prosperity? As I mentioned earlier, these are hugely complex international issues which have to be resolved. We need highly qualified and knowledgeable negotiators on our behalf, and IMHO the current U.S. Special Presidential Envoy for Climate is not that.

  45. Kit Gerhart Says:

    37 Another not-so-accurate prediction by Popular Science regarding nuclear power.

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/x-ray_delta_one/19322743838/in/photolist-oYsLJP-Eiumvc-6Z84ch-c4w1sE-7upxk3-7epBGd-7in4hV-9sjBAr-vru7xQ-7witeh-6XHVMu-7FpkLL-8GfAHb-pnMRzN-HVaqFY-6XDDEm-7ppGxZ-6XHVJY-7hdqQy-SdWrkw-8EMo7B-8VbKgP

  46. Clem Zahrobsky Says:

    i remember my friends early 60s pontiac had a 45 rpm record player in the glovebox.

  47. Sean Wagner Says:

    Test, test.

    If there ever was a vehicle ideally suited to true hybrid propulsion, it would have to be the Wrangler. Magneto is a great name, but that drivetrain should remain a one-off.

  48. cwolf Says:

    There is little doubt the ICE will be around for years to come. I just can’t comprehend why manufacturers have given up on cars for over-loaded and costly trucks and suv’s. The argument that cars are unprofitable is nonsense because the Asians seem to be doing OK, just not as profitable, perhaps. Maybe just not as greedy as those in the truck market. I find it unfortunate the hefy truck profits are used to bankroll the move towards electrics when the market share stagnates at 2%. I think the Asians, like Toyota, have a more realistic view and as a result have offerings that are more affordable or aimed towards more simple transportation the customer asks for. Just my 2 cents.