AD #3190 – Tesla Now Worth $1 Trillion; Mercedes Delays U.S. EQC Again; Can New Polestar 2 Boost Sales Performance?
October 26th, 2021 at 11:52am
Listen to “AD #3190 – Tesla Now Worth $1 Trillion; Mercedes Delays U.S. EQC Again; Can New Polestar 2 Boost Sales Performance?” on Spreaker.
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Runtime: 10:49
0:07 Tesla Now Worth $1 Trillion
0:43 Tesla Model 3 Tops European Sales Chart
1:20 Canoo Taps Panasonic for Battery Supplies
2:02 Panasonic Reveals Prototype 4680 Cell
3:17 Volta Trucks Looking for Sales & Service Locations
4:14 Audi Launching RS 3 Sedan & Sportback
5:51 Mercedes Delays U.S. EQC Again
7:08 Can Single Motor Polestar 2 Boost Sales Performance?
8:52 Wild Porsche Raises Awareness for Good Cause
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TESLA NOW WORTH $1 TRILLION
It’s a stunning historical landmark. Yesterday Tesla became the first automaker to hit a $1 trillion market cap. In fact, only 4 other companies are in the club: Apple, Microsoft, Alphabet and Amazon. Tesla’s stock is now over $1,000 a share. What triggered the jump was the announcement yesterday that Hertz is buying 100,000 Teslas for its rental fleet. Even Elon Musk was puzzled that the Hertz announcement goosed the stock price, since Tesla is already selling every car it can make.
TESLA MODEL 3 TOPS EUROPEAN SALES CHART
Tesla also set a record in Europe. The Model 3 was the best-selling vehicle in Europe last month, the first time an electric vehicle has topped the sales charts and the first time a vehicle built outside Europe took the top spot. Tesla delivered about 24,600 units in September, a 58% increase compared to a year ago. But we say be careful with these numbers. Tesla always backloads its sales to the end of each quarter, when it reports massive jumps. And if it holds to this practice we’ll see a big drop in sales this month.
CANOO TAPS PANASONIC FOR BATTERY SUPPLIES
EV startup Canoo selected Panasonic to supply batteries for its upcoming Lifestyle Vehicle. And it’s going to use a cell-to-pack design. Instead of placing battery modules in an enclosure that’s sealed and bolted into the chassis, Canoo integrates the modules directly into the structure. Canoo’s Lifestyle Vehicle will be built by contract manufacturer VDL Nedcar starting in the fourth quarter of 2022 and will be sold in both the U.S. and Europe. The model has an estimated range of 250 miles or a little over 400 kilometers and has a starting price just under $35,000.
PANASONIC REVEALS PROTOTYPE 4680 BATTERY CELL
Panasonic also showed off a prototype version of its 4680 cylindrical cell, the one Tesla will use. The 4680 battery capacity is five times larger than the previous 2170 cell. Panasonic plans to start trial production of the new battery in Japan by March of next year. It also said it has no plans to develop LFP or lithium-iron phosphate batteries. A number of automakers, including Tesla, are using that battery chemistry for lower priced EVs because they are significantly cheaper.
VOLTA TRUCKS LOOKING FOR SALES & SERVICE LOCATIONS
Volta Trucks, an electric commercial vehicle startup that’s headquartered in Sweden, will have its first transporter, the Volta Zero, on European roads sometime next year. To reach that goal, it’s now looking for sales and service locations in its launch cities of London, Madrid, Milan and Paris. The Volta Zero is a large vehicle designed for inner-city use with a range between 150 and 200 kilometer or 95 and 125 miles. It’s a unique design and, as you can see here, the driver sits in a central location with large glass windows all around to improve visibility. There are also two digital screens to replace the side-view mirrors and three displays in the middle, a quick glance away to provide the driver with the information they need. Volta says it currently has more than 2,500 pre-orders for the Zero.
AUDI LAUNCHING RS 3 SEDAN & SPORTBACK
Audi is getting ready to launch the performance version of the A3 sedan and wagon. The RS 3 Sedan and Sportback feature a reworked version of Audi’s award-winning 2.5L turbocharged 5-cylinder engine. It now produces nearly 400 horsepower and about 370 lb-ft of torque, which is roughly 15 more lb-ft. That boost helps the car go from 0-100 km/h in 3.8 seconds, 3-tenths faster than before. And a new exhaust system with fully variable internal flaps, a first for the RS 3, means the engine is always singing its finest tune. Another first is a new torque splitter. It uses electronically controlled clutch packs with multiple discs on each rear axle to distribute torque between the wheels, rather than the old setup, which featured a multiple disc clutch upstream from the axles. It’s already pretty easy to spot an RS 3, but if you’re looking for specific design cues, the large air intakes and expressive colors are a dead giveaway. But they also feature unique bumpers with their own grille pattern design, air outlets behind the front tires as well as sport seats, carbon fiber trim and a number of RS logos. The RS 3 Sedan and Sportback go on sale in Europe at the end of the month with the sedan starting at 62,000 euros or about $72,000 and the Sportback at 60,000 euros or nearly $70-grand.
WHAT’S UP WITH THE MERCEDES EQC IN THE U.S.?
When Mercedes Benz unveiled its all electric EQC in late 2018, it said it would go on sale in the U.S. in 2019. Then, in 2019 it said it would go on sale in 2021. Now, in 2021 it says it will go on sale in 2025. So what the heck is going on? Here’s our Autoline Insight. The EV market largely yawned when Mercedes unveiled the EQC. It didn’t set any benchmarks in styling or EV technology. No doubt U.S. dealers told Mercedes they didn’t want the car. Now Autoforecast Solutions says the current version of the EQC will go out of production in Bremen, Germany in May of 2023. So that means the U.S. market will get the next generation, which hopefully will be a much more attractive vehicle when it comes out.
CAN SINGLE MOTOR POLESTAR 2 BOOST SALES PERFORMANCE?
Polestar hopes the introduction of the single motor version of the Polestar 2 will ramp up sales. Through the first 9 months of the year it only sold 1,700 cars in the U.S. market. The dual motor version of the car comes with over 400 horsepower and costs $61,000. The single motor version comes with 231 horsepower and costs about $45,000. Both prices are before any incentives. While the dual motor version was a rocket off the line and accelerated quickly at any speed, the single motor version is quick off the line but lacks the punch of its big brother in passing maneuvers. Both versions have the same 78 kilowatt-hour battery pack, which delivers 249 miles of range with the dual motor, and 270 miles with the single motor.
Even though the single motor version is $16,000 cheaper, the designers maintained a good looking interior thanks to the clever use of texture and fabric to create a visually appealing cockpit. The lower price will definitely open up the market to more customers but what Polestar really needs are more retail outlets, a CUV and a U.S. manufacturing base. That’s all happening. Polestar Is opening 15 retail stores this year, and it will build the Polestar 3 CUV at the Volvo assembly plant in South Carolina. The Polestar 2 is made in China meaning it gets hit with a 27.5% import tax. We estimate that building in the U.S. will save Polestar about $9,000 per vehicle.
WILD PORSCHE RAISES AWARENESS FOR GOOD CAUSE
Here’s a cool creation that’s raising awareness for a good cause. Renée Brinkerhoff, an amateur rally driver, has raced an old 1956 Porsche 356 A on six continents to shine light on the problem of child trafficking. And she’s now on the final leg of her world tour, a race across Antarctica. But that requires some special equipment. So, the rear tires were replaced with snow tracks and a pair of skis attached to the front that use a specialized brace and suspension system. Despite all the extra weight, the car shouldn’t sink because the skis were specially designed to compact the snow in front of the rear tracks. Weather permitting, the trek will start at the beginning of December and end before the year is out. And we commend Renee for racing for a good cause.
Over the last decade sales of Jeeps exploded worldwide as the model line expanded with cheaper models like the Compass and Renegade. Now the brand is going in the opposite direction with the decidedly upscale Grand Wagoneer and 3-row Grand Cherokee. So what’s coming next? Let’s find out on Autoline After Hours this Thursday when our guest will be Jim Morrison, the head of the Jeep brand. If you’ve got questions you’d like us to ask him, tweet them to us or drop an email to viewermail@autoline.tv.
And that brings us to the end of today’s show. Thanks for joining us and we’ll be right back here again tomorrow.
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Comments (31)
October 26th, 2021 at 12:18 pm
Allot EV news at the top, ICE sprinklings at the bottom.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:25 pm
Sean, I hear a lot of talk about ‘dealer rights’. What actually constitutes a dealer. If an OEM had a ‘test drive’ site but you had to buy the car online, would it still be a dealer? What if the location was ‘repair only’ and sales were online? If an existing OEM introduced a new ‘brand’ could they set up a sales process like Tesla? Just trying to understand what other OEMs could do to level the playing field with Tesla not having to have dealers.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:26 pm
The Panasonic 4680 battery is only one ot the other suppliers , LG is also developing its own 4680 production line and will sell to Tesla , it seems, and Tesla will have its own 4680 battery production lines as well, plus the CATL LFP contract, which is much cheaper, can charge to 100% without affecting battery life, disadvantage? Less energy dense, meaning heavier battery pack , tires will wear faster as a result, The Hertz fleet will probably use CATL LFP batteries to keep cost down.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:30 pm
The new 4680 cell has 5X the capacity of the 2170 but looks to be about 2-3X larger in size. So is maybe 2X the capacity for the same area? Still a great improvement but just saying its 5X the capacity is kind of misleading.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:36 pm
@3, 4: what does the 4680 stand for? I tried to look it up and cannot find it.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:38 pm
#2 VW might go that way, ( I think they already have) , and in Europe I think that is the way VW does it, The USA Dealership model is kind of unique to the US market,etc, with NADA having bought politicians of all stripes, and levels of Gov’t, you can check out Michigan and GMs actions on these, and as John McElroy said change is needed and maybe the US Supreme Court has to act , you have to go way back into history as to the why and how this came about, Automakers vs Dealers, but Tesla never had a Dealer model of sales, and as Michael Dunne has said the Chinese probably won’t have that type of sales model when they come.Theyll want to go Tesla style.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:39 pm
2 Kevin I believe most of the dealership protection laws are aimed at manufacturers selling direct. So no matter what they do with the building and offering service or test drives, they would still have issues with the sales not being through the dealership.
Seems silly, I know and will most likely change in the coming years, but for now until the laws are changed those start ups will face the same issues as Tesla.
I liked the idea that Elio had with contracting pep boys to be their dealerships. Tesla should do the same and avoid the dealership nonsense and work something out with Autozone or some place that can provide service and already has the buildings. No need to build dealerships so customers can take delivery.
October 26th, 2021 at 12:42 pm
@Wim #5 – it refers to the size – 46mm X 80mm
October 26th, 2021 at 1:00 pm
#4&5, size format 4680 , as in Wide46mm×long80mm, this was the size Tesla battery engineers came up with for optimization, I guess in mass manufacturing, if you look closely at the production videos, it looks like an adaptation of a Pop can manufacturing facility, and Elon “batteries coming out like from a machine gun”, way back in Giga 1 Nevada concept, now that Tesla has bought numerous companies with Automation expertise and aquired Hibar and Maxwell for their battery expertise he/ Tesla will execute those ” machine building the machine”, that produces Batteries ,Cars, Supercharging Station , Solar Roofs,Fugly CYBRTRKs that need no paint, and now Robots. Oh those new 4680 batteries will be ” structural packs , as in not much casings , as detailed why put the batteries in a can and then another can? There is a video that Youtube Vlogger Voit in Germany shows the concept, the Seats actually onto to the batteries! Get ready for High Voltage shock of your life.LOL
October 26th, 2021 at 1:11 pm
2 As of last May, a Tesla place near me in Florida was “service only.” I think they planned to sell there. I’ll find out in a few days when I return to Florida.
October 26th, 2021 at 1:14 pm
#4 there will be lesswiring for one less cans for two there are thousands of 21u0 cells vs hundred of 4680s same was in 18650 vs 2170 cells some people say cooling cylindrical cells are easier than pouch or Prismatic cells, and there were less issues with cylindrical cells than Bolts, even @ over a million Tesla sold, and counting, also the startups Lucid and Rivian , and now Canoo have gone Cylindrical, maybe they know something Tesla knows or GM and VW does not know. Ford is going with SKInnovation , and will be similar to LG pouch cells. Interesting times ahead, one thing for sure, the Battery Genie is out of the bottle, ain’t no putting it back, like GM or the company they sold out to did with the EV 1
October 26th, 2021 at 1:14 pm
5 It means 46mm diameter and 80mm length.
October 26th, 2021 at 1:21 pm
4 I looks the the 4680 cells have lower energy density than 2170 cells, if they have only 5 times the capacity. The 4680s have 5.484 times the volume.
October 26th, 2021 at 1:23 pm
#2. Dealer franchise laws in the US did not go into effect until after WWII. Each state has its own franchise laws. Before WWII automakers would often announce arbitrary price cuts or hikes, with dealers often reading about it in the newspaper with no advanced warning. Sometimes the factory would sell overstocked cars during slow sales periods, competing directly against their dealers. So franchise laws were written to protect dealers from that practice. The laws also state that automakers which sold cars through dealers must always do so. That would seem to leave Tesla and other startups which never used the franchise system to sell direct. But powerful dealer lobby groups in many states have successfully limited what the startups can do. And there is no way for traditional automakers to try and do an end-run around them.
October 26th, 2021 at 2:25 pm
@8, 9, 11, 13: thanks
@9: thanks for the explanation. If TESLA has developed/acquired all capabilities to build critical components, the vehicles, and other critical systems like chargers, that seems to me like a significant competitive advantage for TESLA in an industry where the others, the followers, will be dependent on suppliers or still have to develop the know how.
October 26th, 2021 at 2:46 pm
along and Tesla had to blaze a trail to make BEVs fashionable, even as on this website we have doubters and big question marks arise, Elon has the gift of trying to overcome disadvantages and looking far into the future, as his Mom says,and distills things to its core and looks into vertical integration as the root to bring costs down , a look into Space X is enlightening , in an early interview , I think with Scott Pelley in 60 minutes he is amazed that raw materials come in to the factory and out comes Rockets, as in mass production, a feat that is not rivaled yet as of today, not even established Aerospace giants like Boeing and ULA( They have yet to deliver an Astronaut to the ISS,and will be delayed by two more years it seams, as Software and other hurdles persist. You can follow Teslarati Website for more information on Elon companies , and what makes him tick, I’m just another fan , and PROBABLY a Larry as many here often say, but in Electrek and Teslarati there are hundreds of Larrys.LOL
October 26th, 2021 at 2:55 pm
best show ever
October 26th, 2021 at 3:05 pm
#16 oooppps auto correct , Elon and Tesla…..
#15 another thing is Tesla is based in Silicon Valley , and is very much a Software and Electronics hardware/ computer integration company , the FSD computer is developed inhouse , Elon / Tesla hired the best AI and computer designer money can buy , he is Andrej Karpathy. AV- autonomous Vehicles is extremely hard, and it is a race between the Chinese startups and Tesla and others, but a comparo with apples to apples should be done very soon as GM with its Cruise Automation and Fords Blue Cruise and others like Lucid is due in the near future, im talking serious stuff, like in no GEOFENCING, pure AI, let the car navigate without driver intervention,
October 26th, 2021 at 3:18 pm
A couple articles I found comparing 2170 and 4680 cells make no sense at all, and one of them was IEEE. They say that the 2170 cells are 5000 mAH, and the 4680 cells are 9000 mAH. The cells are the same voltage, so with those numbers, the big cells store less than twice the energy, not 5 times, even though the 4680s have more than 5 times the volume. There must be some error there.
As far as cell configuration, it is looking like cylindrical cells are the way to go for cars. They are not used for phones and laptops, because they would not package at all well. No one wants an inch thick smart phone, but for cars, that is not an issue. I have a multiband portable radio that uses one 18650 cell. That makes a lot of sense, in that when the cell goes bad, it can be easily replaced, the same as if they’d used a single C cell, except the 18650 can be recharged many times.
October 26th, 2021 at 3:25 pm
18 Tesla is now, or will soon be based in Texas, land of cowboys and guns everywhere. Yeah, the Austin area doesn’t particularly fit the usual Texas stereotypes.
October 26th, 2021 at 3:47 pm
19 Kit – I don’t think there’s good current data on Tesla’s 4680 cells in the public domain. Will gladly be proven wrong. They’re still working out some mass-manufacturing kincks and (gulp) maybe concurrently evolving the cell further. How else to keep Tesla newbies sharp and hone that edge?
Conversely, there’s a lot of literature covering mixed materials. Cadillac went that way with the CT6, and even had a decently-sized die-cast Aluminum part they were quite proud of. It’s even featured here: http://www.assemblymag.com/articles/93777-new-techniques-for-joining-steel-and-aluminum
October 26th, 2021 at 3:51 pm
Boca Chica is where Space X Has its biggest footprint from what I know and is a few miles from Giga Austin,Elon moved there, sold 5 or 6 of his California houses,or is in the process of selling all of them,( not sure where his 7 kids live) as in the news, he has a small house near or in Space X compound, looks like a Prefab house, everything is bigger in Texas except his house it seems , the Texas Giga is nearly a mile long and minimum 3 floors high judging by the many drone shots, and easily the biggest by factory Floor Space . And there is a recruitment drive ongoing , i think and the university grads are welcome, Giga Texas will have an opening soon, like Berlin Country Fair Festival with Carnivals and Ferris Wheel it seems.
Elon works long hours,often in Boca Chica ,on the Rockets,and as with the Sandy Munro One on One interview , late into the night with the rocket engineers.
October 26th, 2021 at 3:56 pm
Incidentally, my local Swiss mobility provider (glorified car rentals) is now adding the Seat Mii, VW ID.3, and Tesla Model 3 EVs. I had a talk with a technician and he sang the praises of Tesla’s mobile rangers, specifically in contrast to conventional service.
Even though Tesla still is wedded to those idiosyncratic end-of-quarter sprints, coming in tops overall (!) with the Model 3 in September in Europe is noteworthy. People seem to have no qualms about buying cars made in China either.
gm really should aim to get the Lyriq into overseas showrooms asap. At least virtual ones – Tesla has had no problems with their sales model here. None. Nada.
October 26th, 2021 at 5:33 pm
I just learned something about these cylindrical batteries. They are very low current, compared to the flat batteries I use for model airplanes. The airplane batteries have “C” ratings, a number multiplied by the mAH capacity giving the safe current draw for the battery. The airplane batteries have “C” ratings up to 50, and maybe higher, and nearly all are 30 or higher. A 2000 mAH C30 battery can be discharged at 60 amps. On the other hand, a 5000 mAH 21700 cell I found has a maximum current rating of 15A, a “C” rating of 3. Of course, the high discharge rate batteries I use for model airplanes don’t last very long, 3 years with fewer than 100 cycles is typical.
October 26th, 2021 at 5:59 pm
#24 to my knowledge Teslas panasonic cells have Teslas unique chemistry as Jeff Dahn was a partner for years for getting the most life and longetivity of the cells, R&D with him and Dalhousie is still on going, last i heard.Tesla BMS are also unique in that each cell was fuse, a short or a cell that fails is taken out of the circuit,and there were 4000+ cells in a Tesla mod S, latest teardown of i think of the Plaid pack shows more streamlined pack system. But think of this,the modS plaid is a nearly 4800 pound of 4drsedan, yet the Rimac Nevera is Carbon Fiber, probably is 1500 to 2000 pounds less and is a 2 seater, but it accelerates only.5 seconds less than a bigger car, has quad motors,the math does not compute, on most other aspects the Nevera is superior, but @ $2,000,000?
October 26th, 2021 at 9:14 pm
Interestingly, the Model S Plaid uses the little 18650 cells, but a lot of them. That configuration must be good for pulling lots of current for a period of time, like going from 0-150 mph.
https://insideevs.com/news/540380/tesla-models-plaid-battery-open/
October 27th, 2021 at 3:33 am
24 Kit – Very interesting. So those model airplane batteries are used similarly to racing engines! A C-rate of 3 is indeed the common upper boundary for EV battery cells. Which is why I’d like to know more about the Ioniq 5′s super-fast charge rate.
The Plaid’s 18650 cells are I think a “historical” remnant from Tesla’s early days. There have been endless online discussions about the feasibility of updating them to newer formats. At least the chemistry can keep pace.
October 27th, 2021 at 8:28 am
As has been mentioned many times before the next new battery can change everything. No doubt lots of R&D is being spent on battery development. If it improves at the rate as much of our electronics has in recent years then things could be much different in ten years.
October 27th, 2021 at 9:51 am
#26 kit , The mod S is close to a 10 yr old design,and chassis wise it would take a lot of engineering to go from 18650 to 2170 for some short gains in efficiency and power density, this is from what a lot of other Tesla insiders have said,improving chemistry was much simpler from what I gathered, the 4680 cells could be a gamechanger, according to Sandy Munro, and what will be needed to get into the millions of vehicles aimed by Tesla, and will be competitive with Solid State batteries when those can be finally scaled up. Validating and then scaling Solid State batteries will take years,and as Elon has said , “just give us a working sample we can test”.
As proof of the new improved chemistry? The range of the mod S has gone up , from 300+ miles to around 400 on the model.
Each new Tesla Giga factory , starting from Berlin and Texas will have a Tesla dedicated 4680 battery production line, besides Panasonic, and possibly LG being suppliers as well. That is why the Kato facility was for, to do trial R&D and trial runs of 4680 cells,and as stated in Tesla earnings report they are close to production ready.
October 27th, 2021 at 10:16 am
#28 lambo, Giga Nevada has about40 g watt production of Panasonic cells,and is for both cars and Tesla Powerwalls and Megapacks. Fremont car production is probably @ 450,000 to 500,000 and statements from Tesla say 600,000 final when fully optimized, @ the peak when it was NUMMI, production was 423,000 ICE cars. Giga Shanghai has its China battery suppliers -CATL and LG and production there is @ 500,000 cars
Ford and GMs partnerships with SKInnovation and LG are around 40GW – 60Gw so if math is right BEVs from both companies will be around 500,000- Trucks and SUVs need more batteries.Both Ford and GM have to add battery capacity if they are to make 1,000,000 BEVs / year by 2025 and beyond. This year Tesla will make around 800,000+ from two car factories.
October 27th, 2021 at 11:10 am
30 Again info I never asked for but thanks anyway.