AD #3381 – People Hate Car Dealers Who Overcharge; Tesla Semi Ships This Year; Car Sales to Stop Growing In 2036

August 10th, 2022 at 11:51am

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Listen to “AD #3381 – People Hate Car Dealers Who Overcharge; Tesla Semi Ships This Year; Car Sales to Stop Growing In 2036″ on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 10:26

0:08 Car Sales to Stop Growing In 2036
0:47 Honda Profit Plummets 73%
1:23 Russia Exit Strategy for Mercedes, VW 
2:08 Tesla Semi Ships This Year
2:26 Sandy Munro on AAH
3:40 Autonomy Orders $1.2 Billion Of EVs
4:27 EV Future Product Debuts
5:38 Ford Raises Lightning Prices Up To $8,000 
6:27 Ford to Make Cars with Sunshine
7:31 Ferrari Hit With 17-Year Recall
8:10 Mercedes Street-Legal F1 Car
9:00 People Hate Car Dealers Who Overcharge

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31 Comments to “AD #3381 – People Hate Car Dealers Who Overcharge; Tesla Semi Ships This Year; Car Sales to Stop Growing In 2036”

  1. Kit Gerhart Says:

    While is wasn’t as bad as Ford dealers charging $10K over MSRP for Lightnings, and maybe Mavericks, the dealer where I bought my Highlander about 6 months ago charged MSRP, plus about $1200 in bogus add-ons, like “doc fee” and other things, in addition to the actual fee for registering the car. Apparently all Florida Toyota dealer collude, because all of them have similar bogus add-ons. I bought my Highlander from a certain dealer, because they had one coming in the was close to what I wanted. Toyota still doesn’t do customer orders, even for cars from Indiana and Kentucky.

    In comparison, I paid MSRP plus sales tax for my Corvette, and nothing more. Some dealers have been charging well over MSRP to order Corvettes, though.

  2. Buzzerd Says:

    I haven’t overpaid for a vehicle but, long story short, we overpaid for a dishwasher and my wife has refused to shop there ever since, even with a friend working there. It wasn’t much money but it was the point of it, she felt they lied over a few dollars so what are they going to do if we have a real problem.

  3. Lambo2015 Says:

    Ford raising the price of the lightning; wouldn’t have anything to do with the recent inflation reduction act that will likely extend government incentives of Wow just about the same amount as Fords increase. Right around that $7000 mark. hum that seems legit. Yea sure its material increases. lol

  4. ChuckGrenci Says:

    List price plus inflated add-ons across the board at my local Cadillac dealer: ceramic coating, door protection and nitrogen filled tires; gives me pause when shopping. These add-ons were even listed on vehicles in-transit (though perhaps they might be evaded if asked and before they hit the dealer’s lot), but then again maybe not.

  5. Lambo2015 Says:

    3 Cont- So really what the incentives are doing is increasing the profits for the car makers and raising prices for the buyer all paid for by the tax payer. This is why incentives should stop.

  6. Kit Gerhart Says:

    3 Ford is raising prices on the Lightning for the same reason Tesla has raised prices dramatically, because the market will bear it. I’m surprised GM hasn’t raised prices more on Corvettes.

    I’ve read that a lot of EVs won’t be eligible for the tax credit because they don’t have enough American content. John or Sean, can you discuss the details sometime?

  7. Albemarle Says:

    Frankly, I don’t think it matters whether it’s the dealer or the manufacturer. Jerking customers around with prices is just wrong. Even Tesla, without dealers, suddenly increasing prices by thousands, even to customers waiting for their cars, is bad.

    I have many reasons why I will never buy a Tesla, but this goes on the list too. Wonderful software doesn’t overcome crappy cars, volatile pricing and ridiculous promises, even with big-ass castings.

  8. Kit Gerhart Says:

    1,4 I’d about forgotten, but the Toyota dealer had a big bogus add-on that they were quickly willing to drop.

    4 I don’t know what my local Cadillac dealer is doing. I drive through their lot every week or two, but they have zero new cars to check the stickers. I’m not in the market, so haven’t talked to sales people about it.

    They still have the used 2022 Tesla Model X that I first saw a couple weeks ago. They list it at $131,999. It’s not a “Plaid,” so that is quite a bit over new sticker, but there is a long wait for ordered ones. I suspect the price would be negotiable, since it hasn’t sold.

  9. Lex Says:

    @ 3 Lambo2015, I totally agree with your conclusion. The Traditional OEM’s are trying to extract the $7,500.00 new Biden Inflation Reduction Act for themselves from consumers using the excuse of higher material costs. Once the Chinese EVs hit North America it will be a tidal wave of customers heading into their showrooms and the demise of legacy automakers! Penny Wise and Dollar Foolish, You have to give credit to the Bean Counters and MBA’s for cutting their own noses off to spite their faces.

  10. johno Says:

    #6 that’s about what i seen on a business channel, because a lot of them have batteries and other parts made in different countries.

  11. Ziggy Says:

    If you paid MSRP then you have already overpaid, in normal times MSRP is usually what the dealer starts at and goes down from there and for people that won’t haggle the dealership is eternally grateful for your lack of spine. For all of you that paid over MSRP and are now complaining about it, what caliber gun did the dealership hold to your head to make you buy something that you felt you were being ripped off by? They only do it because people go for it.

  12. ChuckGrenci Says:

    11, You have a point however not for all instances; some people need to buy and buy right now. When the prices are uniformly high, you’re not going to get the deal you have historically gotten. There are no absolutes currently in the automobile purchasing challenge (of today). As you say, no one has a gun to your head, but you may be between a rock and a hard place (so do the best you can. Wait, if you are in a position to do so, but that’s not always a given. And don’t forget, used cars are artificially high too so not much help there either.

  13. Kit Gerhart Says:

    11,12 In normal times, MSRP is overpaying, for a normal car. MSRP has been a bargain on C8 Corvettes, from when they were introduced. You can sell one to Carmax for $15K over MSRP.

    These are not normal times. No dealers have any new stock in my area. Most incoming cars are sold before they arrive. Maybe you can order a “normal” GM, Ford, or Chrysler and get it in ~6 weeks, as normal, but I’m not sure. I doubt if very many vehicles are selling at much, or any below MSRP, except for especially unpopular models.

  14. Drew Says:

    It is so easy to bash dealerships, but it is no longer sporting to do so. A little historical perspective is needed.

    Forty years ago, the margin between wholesale cost and MSRP was about 16-18% on mass brands and 24+% on luxury brands. Today, that margin is under 10%, including luxury brands. Why? Because customers complained about having to price haggle.

    A little over thirty years ago, Saturn addressed this customer concern via no haggle pricing. Eventually and essentially, every OEM adopted it. But the truth is that “no haggle pricing” meant lower dealer margins.

    So Ziggy, paying MSRP today is not a spineless act, but is a mere reality… particularly when supply is tight.

  15. cozy cole Says:

    Sean, we just bought a car saturday. the Honda dealer wanted 4k on top of a new HR-V. the allentown Mazda dealer wanted 4k market adjustment on their window stickers. then we went to Young Mazda and at present their cars are window sticker. It is amazing what a 2019 Honda Odyssey EX-L is worth that my wife is driving. Almost got a new 2023 Mazda cx-50 PF-P for the trade in value of the Honda. So Yes lots of dealers in the lehigh valley area of Pa. are marking up their cars and trucks. so around here MSRP is a deal.

  16. Lambo2015 Says:

    11 Many people like myself were in a position where my lease just happened to end during this horrible time. I was able to extend my lease up to 6 months hoping things would improve but they did not. I didn’t pay over MSRP because I get employee pricing but there was no incentives from lenders or manufacturers so my lease was quite a bit higher than it has been compared to the last two previous leases. The smart thing would have been to buy out my lease but I didn’t want that vehicle. They did buy out my old lease which helped but everything went up.

  17. Buzzerd Says:

    When we bought our XT4 in spring we paid bellow sticker. I was talking to my friend who is the salesman at the Caddy dealer and he said some of the new Cadillacs are coming in without the chips for things like heated steering wheel and they will not be retrofitted!

  18. Kit Gerhart Says:

    16 That’s too bad that you didn’t like your vehicle, it was a “lemon,” or whatever, because it would have been a bargain for you to buy out your lease. I assume the residual value was based on pre-pandemic used car values?

  19. Kit Gerhart Says:

    17 They need to ship the ones without heated steering wheels to Florida and Arizona.

  20. Wim van Acker Says:

    @4: do you know what benefit filling tires with nitrogen has?

  21. Wim van Acker Says:

    @9 is that because we are expecting an influx of cheap EVs produced in China or from U.S. production of Chinese EVs like the Polestar?

  22. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20 Supposedly it leaks out more slowly than air, but since air is 80% nitrogen, that doesn’t make much sense. Also, isn’t nitrogen a smaller atom than oxygen? It has a lower atomic number.

  23. Kit Gerhart Says:

    20 Here’s what Continental says about using nitrogen in tires.

    https://www.continental-tires.com/car/tire-knowledge/tire-care-maintenance/tire-pressure/nitrogen-in-tires#:~:text=Nitrogen%20in%20highly%20specialized%20tire%20service%20applications&text=Dry%20nitrogen%20mitigates%20tire%20pressure,vehicle%20handling%20at%20extreme%20speeds.

  24. Cozy Cole Says:

    Question. How do they get all the air out of the tire to replace it with only nitrogen?????

  25. Wim van Acker Says:

    @22 yes, air is 80% nitrogen, and the remaining 20% are mainly oxygen and CO2. I had to look it up, but you are right: the atomic number of nitrogen is 7 and of oxygen 8. I believe in both case the molecules contain two atoms: O2 and N2, so why it would be good I am not yet getting. CO2 is a much larger molecule than O2 and N2.

  26. Wim van Acker Says:

    @23: thanks for that article. It is very interesting, and according to Continental it does not have benefits for ordinary vehicles.

  27. Cozy Cole Says:

    Yes. Thanks Kit. It is so nice to get in your car start it and check tire pressure on your display screen. After a hard drive around some back roads pressure up 2 psi. No problem what a great feature

  28. Cozy Cole Says:

    Yes. Thanks Kit. It is so nice to get in your car start it and check tire pressure on your display screen. After a hard drive around some back roads pressure up 2 psi. No problem what a great feature

  29. Kit Gerhart Says:

    24 I’d wondered that too. You can’t evacuate a tire on a wheel like you can a bell jar. Maybe you put the whole wheel and tire in a big bell jar and evacuate it. Anyway, from the Continental article, there’s not much point.

  30. Kit Gerhart Says:

    25 CO2 sounds interesting. I’d think it would leak slowly, being a larger molecule, but what would pressure do with temp change? CO2 is strange, having a liquid state only at high pressure. Dry ice evaporates, without melting.

  31. ChuckGrenci Says:

    Tire pressure changes due to temperature is constant for all the gases (I cite the gas laws we learned in chemistry). The only variable, and this is slight would be in the amount of water vapor in the tire. Use of air, as opposed to nitrogen in your typical car, is just a money grab, and if you see what some are charging (my Cadillac dealer listed nitrogen as $299) you can call this abusive. Costco uses nitrogen and charges nothing (okay, maybe it’s cooked into the price) but the actual cost is a whole lot less than what I earlier stated.

    Moving on; I found a YouTube from Motoman with an interview with the Chief Engineer for the Celestiq. It is twenty minutes if you choose to watch. Link: https://youtu.be/fuzb1eq3bUE