AD #2611 – Automakers Ask Trump to Back Off, Kia K900 Impressions, EV Growth Over the Last 5 Years

June 7th, 2019 at 11:40am

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Listen to “AD #2611 – Automakers Ask Trump to Back Off, Kia K900 Impressions, EV Growth Over the Last 5 Years” on Spreaker.

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Runtime: 9:10

0:06 Automakers Ask Trump to Back Off Emissions Proposal
0:59 Affordability Could Have Big Impact on Sales
1:35 ZF Shows Video of External Side Airbag in Action
2:31 Cadillac Expands Super Cruise
3:29 Kia K900 Impressions
5:21 Electric Vehicle Trend Chart
6:12 Toyota & Subaru Developing BEV Platform
6:48 Why Book by Cadillac Didn’t Work

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38 Comments to “AD #2611 – Automakers Ask Trump to Back Off, Kia K900 Impressions, EV Growth Over the Last 5 Years”

  1. bradley cross Says:

    Yes, delay for 5 years and also slightly increase those standards after the 5 years to give something to CA.

    I read the CARB boss mentioned banning gas cars in a few years and then later said just kidding as wanted to scare the auto maters. What alovely business environment.

    Bye a used K900 if you want a deal!

  2. Albemarle Says:

    The ZF outside air bags looks to be a great idea. Finally some crash mitigation that might cut the costs of repairs. Imagine having a crash where body damage is minimal. Wouldn’t that be nice.

  3. GM Veteran Says:

    Nice job Jack! The K900 needs an exterior styling injection. Talk about bland!

  4. Bradley Says:

    ZF outer airbags are great! I would like to see both vehicles have them. Or are they only on the sides of cars?

  5. MJB Says:

    #1. Agreed – buy a used K900. They’re very under-valued. Not to mention, the body styling is a bit better on the outgoing model (imho). The daytime running LEDs on this new one make it look like its got bags under its eyes.

  6. MJB Says:

    Off-topic, but I just saw a YouTube ad for the Nissan Leaf where they blatantly claimed “Best selling electric vehicle of all-time”.

    Okay, am I missing something? How is that even possible given the runaway sales that Tesla has been having of late?

  7. MJB Says:

    #6. Correction, it was a Spotify ad, not YouTube…

  8. WineGeek Says:

    Lots to comment on today
    1) Why don’t the automakers just produce one car that meets the California standards. They already have this car developed why produce 2 different emission systems?
    2) 68% growth is still pretty good maybe not 100% but still impressive.
    3) The entire “Book” idea and similar programs from other manufacturers is foolish. The premium is too high over ownership to make it practical or desirable to the consumer.
    That’s my Friday vent!
    Have a great weekend.

  9. Barry T Says:

    6 Nissan Leaf has surpassed 400,000 GLOBAL sales, and it’s a single model. Tesla does seem to grab all the headlines, no doubt.

  10. DonWagner1239 Says:

    #8: Answer, cost. But, I’ve been retired since 2001 and in our thermal testing, there were two emissions systems, Federal and California. Must have been combined since then. The California cars cost more to cover the increased emissions hardware.

    On EVs, one of my sons-in-law in Massachusetts (Boston area) would like to get a Fiat 500 EV, but even though MA is one of the 13 states with lower MPG CO2 standards, that vehicle is only sold in Oregon and California. His theory is more sold, cost loss would be lower (Marchione statements).

    Also. remember that Obama’s EPA “jumped the shark” and moved the standards up (sooner) than the law that was written at the time, so backing off, and moving back is not unexpected.

  11. ArtG Says:

    6. I’ve been seeing that ad on TV.

  12. DonWagner1239 Says:

    Oh, and how long has it been since that oil was changed in that under body view? My two Jeeps have a function that monitors oil life. And I have an “app for that” on my iphone. Makes it really easy not to have to guess when to change, especially since the cost is pretty high these days.

  13. Clem Zahrobsky Says:

    Why not just build all the vehicles to meet calif std no matter where they are sold ??

  14. Kit Gerhart Says:

    6,7,9 It’s global sales, and they have been selling Leaves for about 10 years. The record won’t hold for long, with 200K+ Tesla Model 3s a year being built.

  15. Drew Says:

    @10 & 13 – To paraphrase the late Sergio, each EV loses money on an economic/variable cost basis. It’s a financial blood bath when development cost are accounted. Higher volume equates to higher losses. So, OEMs have to balance supply-side mandates versus shareholder value plus the cost to train/support the retail network. In this context, I don’t blame OEMs from “choosing” markets with the best potential to satisfy customers, regulators, and shareholders. And I doubt customers in northern states (including the socialist state… errr…commonwealth of Massachusetts) will be satisfied with a cold weather driving range that is about 60% of the advertised range.

    BTW, CA emissions hardware is many hundreds of dollars more costly than Federal emissions hardware.

  16. Kit Gerhart Says:

    It’s a mystery to me why they even sell the K900. Hyundai is having a hard enough time selling Geneses, even though, minimally equipped, some of them are a good buy, and they are starting to have stand-alone showrooms kind of like Lexus. It’s no wonder people don’t shop for a $60K+ Kia which is sitting next to a a Rio in the showroom.

  17. Kit Gerhart Says:

    13,15 Some cars are all built with CA emissions, including my Camry hybrid, and, I think, my 2010 Mini. The manufacturer’s decision on that would depend on the expected volume for the car in states using the CA regs, and how easy it is to meet the regs. I suspect the Camry hybrid, or any serious hybrid would meet the CA regs fairly easily.

  18. Kit Gerhart Says:

    The Canadian GP might be more interesting than most recent races.

  19. ChuckGrenci Says:

    Personally I have found the season to be pretty interesting (just not the outcomes); this one should provide at least a challenge to the Mercedes dominance, being as the top cars are very close and not all M/B it may be wide open. Go Ferrari.

  20. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I didn’t see the qualifying, just the results, but it looks like Renault picked it up a little, and something went seriously awry for Verstappen.

  21. Kit Gerhart Says:

    “Interesting” Canadian GP. The commentators seemed to mostly agree that the penalty was unwarranted. Ferrari can’t seem to catch a break.

  22. ChuckGrenci Says:

    I agree with the commentators and for all the reasons mentioned. With a wall to the left and wall to the right and no pavement to slow or maneuver Vettel maintained his line. You got to let these guys race. Anyway that’s my take.

  23. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I agree too, and, quite likely, there would have been more good racing at the front.

  24. Kit Gerhart Says:

    I saw an interesting car ad during the Tony Awards broadcast. It was a a VW electric car ad, with Simon and Garfunkels’ “Sounds of Silence” and no spoken words. They must be advertising for the future, because, to my knowledge, VW doesn’t even sell any EVs in the US now.

  25. Kit Gerhart Says:

    24 I missed the start of the ad, unless there are multiple versions. I read that the ad starts with radio snippets about dieselgate, before going into the part I mentioned in #24.

  26. Larry D. Says:

    The Genesis division and the K900 are halo cars. Hyundai-kia knows they will never make a dime off them, but they will make buyers of Accents and Sonatas happy that their brands have such upscale vehicles and not just econoboxes.

    I would not give an Kia the time of day, new or used. When i can buy the best cars in the world for $10-15k, E class, S class, 7 series and if youc are, the LS and the audis) why bother?????

  27. Larry D. Says:

    VW is taking EVs extremely seriously, and last week I saw the first NEW 20,000 Euro EV.

    It is a SKODA (a division of VW, with a German CEO, in the Czech republic. SKODA works were very advanced before W W II.

    The $20k new EV is far better looking than either the Leaf or the Bolt. It looks almost identical to the boxy VW “UP!”, a roomy subcompact with a tall roof and a vertical rear.

    The “UP” is a bit smaller than the VW Polo which is a bit smaller than the GOLF Best selling car in Europe.

    THIS is Serious.

  28. Larry D. Says:

    Both John and Lambo and many others here, whenever they talk about EVs, they solely talk about the US market.

    The US market is currently a far second to CHina, and I expect it to be a distant THIRD, after China AND Europe. Unless Tesla can sell in the states it is currently banned (as John mentioned, well over 100 million buyers there) in the USA, or unless it starts offering a cheap Crossover, or a car smaller than the Model 3, its growth in the US is much more limited than that overseas.

  29. Kit Gerhart Says:

    26 I suspect Hyundai’s plan was to make money with Genesis, especially as they try to make it a Lexus-like sub brand, but so far, things are not going very well. Their having only sedans certainly doesn’t help, at least in the US.

  30. Lambo2015 Says:

    8&13 A couple reasons why they don’t build all vehicles to the CA emissions. 1) As already mentioned is cost. With all states that follow the CA emissions they account for about 28% of the 17M being sold. If its only $200 more to make it compliant times the remaining 13.2M means 2.6 Billion to equip all cars. Which yea it could be passed on to the consumer but many people would not want to pay for something above and beyond. 2)The other reason is performance. With the added equipment and/or changes in engine mapping the performance typically suffers. Adding restrictions means impact to MPG which means reduce power to achieve the efficiency. Constant battle to get mileage, emissions and HP. Expect more of any one of the three and the others suffer.

    28 When I comment on EVs its typically in relation to the US because I believe the US market is and will remain much different than many other parts of the world. Gas prices here are much different and our cities and hwys are much different all of which contribute to the vehicle we drive and how we drive. This is why the tiny cars of Europe do not do as well here in the US and the same could be said for Diesel cars. The US car market developed from the big boat like cars of the 50s and 60s and a massive interstate highway system. Which is why although I believe EVs will flourish in many other parts of the world I doubt they will achieve great success in the US.

  31. Kit Gerhart Says:

    27 I remember seeing a lot of “old” rear engine Skodas when I was in Czechoslovakia in the summer of 1992, a few months before the country split. VW had bought into Skoda, but was still making some of the old stuff at the time.

    Now, Skoda is sort of a value brand for VW in Europe, but not as “badge engineered” as Ford and Mercury were at the end. Having lots of brands still seems to work in Europe, with VW having about 8 brands, three mainstream brands when you include Spanish SEAT.


    28) Just to clarify, there is no ban on sales of TESLA in any state. TESLA has banned themselves from selling in every state. Every state has laws that all companies must follow including TESLA. They don’t want to follow them so they have chosen a self imposed ban on sales in those states. It doesn’t matter if TESLA thinks these laws are unfair to them, get over it and get to selling just like every other manufacturer in the world has done.

    After a decade of them whining about the laws in these states, you would think that they would get the hint and start selling according to the laws in those states. And yet here we are. TESLA arrogance is their greatest weakness.

  33. Larry D. Says:

    32 I am not interested in splitting hairs, everybody understands very well what I meant.

    In MI and many other large states, TESLA is FORBIDDEN to open its TESLA Stores and sell its cars directly to the customers, as is the case in every state with SO MANY OTHER INDUSTRIES. i find this absolutely OUTRAGEOUS and a violation of FREE TRADE which, INDEED, has made America GREAT.

    I am NOT interested in driving 3 hours to CLEVELAND to buy a Tesla, and then having to go back there every time i need a service that cant be done over the air.

  34. Larry D. Says:

    31 I was not referring to post-WW II god-awful Commie Skodas. SKODA was a huge weapons producer even before WW I, when the Chech Republic and Slovakia and all these other southern slavic nations, a total of 40 nationalities, were part of the (misnamed) Austro-Hungarian Empire, one of the top five or six World Powers at the start of WW I. it was very highly regarded then.

  35. Kit Gerhart Says:

    34 Those later pre-VW Skodas were better than their direct competition from Trabant and Lada. Yeah, that’s not saying much.

  36. Larry D. Says:

    Anything was better than the Trabant. Those Skodas were not better than the Ladas, which were old Fiats with a 1953 Fiat Engine (1500 cc I believe, some of them) which were crude but OK. I know people who owned both of these. The one had a 4 door Lada 1500 he bought in 1976 and kept it until 1991. he was a terrible driver and had many fender benders. The other was the older brother of a good friend and classmate in high school, who became a dentist and most of his career was fixing teeth of inmates at a major ‘lunatic asylum’. He was very happy with the Skoda (irrationally so) but he did not know better.


    33) TESLA could just do like every other manufacturer does and follow the law. No one is preventing them from operating in accordance with the law. That is not splitting hairs. There is no hinderance of free trade as TESLA could freely trade in the state just as every other manufacturer does by following the laws of those states.

    TESLA simply refuses to follow the law and thusly they cannot sell in those states. Those laws have been on the books for decades so it isn’t like anyone put something in place to specifically ban TESLA from doing business. They just don’t want to follow the law and thusly banned themselves from those states.

    TESLA is at fault for you not being able to buy a TESLA in Michigan. FYI, you can have your TESLA serviced in Michigan by TESLA themselves. They opened a service network in accordnace with Michigan Law. See how that works? Follow the law and things happen.

  38. Larry D. Says:

    Spare me the lecture. I could care less for greedy dealers.

    No matter what happens, TESLA is heads and shoulders above any domestic maker, and Musk is 100 times that compared to their stupid CEOs and VPS.

    TESLA has made automotive history ALREADY.