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Runtime: 9:55
0:00 Tesla Sales Soar in Norway Despite Musk Bias
0:47 Geely Catching Up to BYD
1:34 VinFast Founder Pours More Money Into the Company
2:33 Lucid Gravity SUV Falls Flat
3:41 Pony.ai Racks Up Impressive Growth
4:42 Stellantis Nightmare as Dongfeng Heads to Italy
5:32 Chinese Fuel Cell Company Gets U.S. Order
6:10 Rimac Skeptical of 3,000 HP Yangwang
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This is Autoline Daily, the show dedicated to enthusiasts of the global automotive industry.
TESLA SALES SOAR AS NORWAY SHRUGS OFF ANTI-MUSK BIAS
Here’s an interesting development. Car buyers in Norway have shrugged off their anti-Musk feelings and have started ordering Teslas again, especially the new Model Y. In the first half of the year, sales shot up 24%. Reuters reports that buyers seem to be willing to turn a blind eye because they love Tesla’s Supercharging network and the ease of using the car’s tech. However, its sales in Europe have been a disaster so far this year, down 40%. So now the question is, will the rest of Europe follow Norway’s lead and start buying more Teslas? Or is this just something unique to Norway?
GEELY CATCHING UP TO BYD
BYD is the shining example of China’s booming auto industry. Everyone seems to be talking about it. It’s always ‘BYD did this and BYD did that.’ Last year it surpassed Honda and Nissan in global sales. And it surpassed Ford in operating profits. But guess what? Now Geely is catching up to BYD. In the first half of the year Geely sailed past the Volkswagen Group and is now the second largest car company in China. Even though BYD’s sales grew 33%, Geely’s grew even faster, up 47%. In July, Geely was only 61,000 units behind BYD, and analysts believe it will continue to maintain its growth as more new models hit the market.
VINFAST FOUNDER POURS ANOTHER $1.5 B INTO COMPANY
Man is it hard being a startup car company. Now comes word that Vinfast’s founder, Pham Nhat Vuong, is pouring another $1.5 billion of his own money into the company as it continues to post losses. This will be on top of the $2 billion he’s already put into the company. In return for his latest investment, he’s going to get Vinfast’s R&D assets, which will be spun off into a separate company. Vinfast is on a major expansion push into India and Indonesia, as it pivots away from the U.S. and Europe where sales have largely failed to materialize. And that makes us wonder if it will ever build its $2 billion U.S. EV assembly plant in South Carolina, which was supposed to open a year ago. Now Vinfast says it will open in 2028, but local media reports that absolutely nothing is happening at the construction site.
LUCID GRAVITY SUV FALLS FLAT
Talk about hard luck EV start up stories. Lucid Motors kicked off production of its Gravity SUV in December but car buyers don’t seem to be very interested. According to S&P Global Mobility, only nine Gravity’s were registered in the U.S. in the first half. By comparison, Lucid’s Air Sedan had 4,780 registrations. Lucid doesn’t dispute S&P’s number, but says it’s misleading because there’s a lag between when vehicles are sold and when they’re registered. It says sales of the Gravity are actually in the “multiple hundreds.” It also blames production delays. Even so, that’s a pretty low number. And Lucid is counting on that SUV to dramatically boost sales.
PONY.AI RACKS UP IMPRESSIVE GROWTH
Autonomous vehicle company Pony.ai only reported a small amount of revenue in its second quarter results, but we’re impressed by its rate of growth. Revenue came to roughly $21.5 million, which was up over 50% compared to Q1 and up nearly 76% over last year. Its robotaxi operations generated only $1.5 million in the quarter, but that was also up almost 160% compared to last year. And Pony.ai has the potential to keep this growth going too. It currently has over 500 robotaxis in its fleet, but it expects to reach 1,000 before the end of the year. And its newest generation of vehicles are cheaper and longer lasting as well. It slashed its autonomous hardware costs by 70% compared to the previous system and the new vehicles offer a design lifespan of 10 years or 600,000 kilometers, which is about 373,000 miles.
STELLANTIS NIGHTMARE: DONGFENG PUSHES INTO ITALY
This has got to be a nightmare scenario for Stellantis CEO Antonio Filosa. He’s under enormous pressure from the Italian government to boost Fiat’s production in Italy, but the company’s sales and production are falling. And now comes news that Chinese automaker Dongfeng is making a big push into Italy. It just got an order from an Italian distributor to sell 9,000 vehicles a year and is also growing its sales network. It currently has 20 dealerships in Italy and by the end of the year it plans to have 40. To help grow awareness of the brand, Dongfeng is setting up pop-up stores across the country and it’s also demonstrating technology, like its driver assistance system. And for every one it sells, it probably means that Fiat will build one less car.
CHINESE FUEL CELL COMPANY GETS BIG U.S. ORDER
Shanghai Hydrogen Propulsion Technology or SHPT for short seems to be unfazed by any trade war going on between the U.S. and China. It got what it calls a “bulk order” from a U.S. client for its fuel cell stack and says it just delivered the first small batch. The unnamed client is using the stack in mobile power generators, so now SHPT is trying to expand into the same area in Germany, Switzerland and the UAE. Those fuel cells can be used as mobile charging stations for EVs, as well as for providing power at events like concerts or fairs.
RIMAC SKEPTICAL OF YANGWANG 3000 HP CLAIM
Yangwang made headlines when it boasted that a version of its U9 hypercar would come with nearly 3,000 horsepower, but there’s at least one skeptic. The founder and CEO of Rimac, Mate Rimac, says he doubts whether the vehicle can actually deliver all that power due to battery, motor, inverter and tire limitations. He estimates that the car would already have to be going 150 MPH or over 240 km/h to unleash all 3,000 horsepower at once. So, Rimac might be on to something. We think this car is more about setting track records because the standard version of the U9 with nearly 1,300 horsepower is still about 13 seconds slower on the Nurburgring compared to cars from Rimac and Xiaomi.
AUTOLINE POLL ON FORD’S NEW EV PLATFORM
You all heard about Ford’s new Universal EV Platform that was developed by its skunkworks team in Silicon Valley. The platform significantly cuts costs and can support multiple body types. Part of the cost savings comes from a new production process that reduces parts and assembly time. But we want to know what you think about the program. Will it succeed? Will it fail? Or will it be something in between? We have a poll on our YouTube channel right now that’s open to everyone. If you’d like to participate, just click the Posts tab. By the way, this is going to be a major topic on Autoline After Hours later today. The show goes live at 3PM eastern time today on our website and YouTube channel and I hope to see you there.
But that’s a wrap for this show. Thanks for tuning in.
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We already saw thru Ford’s PR BS, Sean. It is a joke. Ford is whistling in the dark while undergoing an EV HELL, losing $5 billion (by its own admission) every YEAR
Lucid results are very surprising. If it could sell 4,700 copies of its old sedan, why would it sell only a fraction of that for its brand new SUV or crossover? Every other maker sells far more crossovers than their sedan cousins, EV or ICE. In fact, the Model Y was the BEST SELLING VEHICLE IN ALL THE WORLD a couple years ago before Elon pissed the environuts and the Trump haters.
Hey, how about these Norwegians, Kit? Did you know they are (by Far) the richest nation in Europe (a couple of mickey-mouse nations like tax haven Monaco excluded)? That makes them inherently evil in your book, and explains why they bought so many Model Ys. (not to mention they are also sexist, racist, and fascist)
Can big castings be repaired after a crash?
The answer will have implications for insurance costs.
If Norwegians are sexist, racist, and fascist, that could explain their again buying Teslas. In reality, Norwegians are probably buying Teslas again, in spite of Elon, because they are good EVs in most ways, and are priced pretty well. They would be getting the Ys from Berlin.
Actually, Switzerland and Ireland are wealthier than Norway in per capita GDP, but yeah, they are “tax havens” that multi-national corporations run their money through, which enters into GDP calculations.
Too soon to tell on Ford’s new BEV pickup. This is another; we’ll produce this or that for under 30 thousand (with a promise date somewhere in the future) that morphs into it never happening. If I were to pick a ‘maybe’ for the 30 thousand promise, I’d speculate that the new Bolt might get an entry model for said price.
While not knowing the ends and outs of what’s going on at Lucid and Gravity, I would guess and wouldn’t at all be surprised if the issue is assembly/quality control/production issue. Tesla, Rivian and even some legacy OEMs have at times have production problems, when they had brand new programs coming off their assembly lines. With them putting out the most expensive versions first, I’m sure many customers (as impatient as they can be) would rather wait for them to get it right the first time, then rush it out the door and constantly return it to fix problems. This vehicle could literally make or break the company, so I’m sure Lucid wants it the be near perfect when it gets into the customer”s hands!
IMHO, Ford’s “new” assembly process will in time meet with success, but there will be hang-ups as the process matures , as with anything new. The question will come down to how much of the old will carried over to the new system, be it familiar processes or attitudes?! If it is a grounds up rethink, having someone stuck in the ‘old ways’ running it, might create challenges on its own. Yet, having something that’s too new, might cause issues in getting it up to speed, when compared to the old system. I believe the line workers will be fine, as long as their direction is clear and defined, but upper, middle and senior management might make the difference of whether it succeeds or fails.
Went to look at why Lucid may not be selling as many Gravity SUVs as they would like. It starts at $95K for a 2 row SUV. Just under $99K for a 3 row which eliminates ALL cargo space. That is pretty steep money and puts it in competition with numerous luxury SUV OEMs. Most of those other SUVs are well established players that have a solid luxury SUV reputation. Lucid has no reputation in that space and it seems that those buyers buy reputation first and foremost. Gravity will likely see low sales until they can establish that ever important reputation amongst that class of buyers. Not single digit low, but pretty low none the less. Such is the fate of BMW from the story yesterday. It is going to be a while before BMW sees volume sales in that category. They may be able to ramp up volume faster than Lucid due to their existing luxury car reputation though.
Also to add to the woes of the Gravity, its exterior design is reminiscent of a Kia Carnival to me. Buyers in that market are not looking for something that looks like a KIA.
On the Ford announcement, To me what Ford did was make a modern EV K-Car. The K-Car saved an entire company so this has the potential to do something similar to Ford.
…the one negative in Ford’s new EV assembly program, it’s that while others like Mercedes, BMW, Stellantis and others are attempting to build ICE and BEVs on the same assembly line, Ford and GM will use two different plants to build their different vehicle types and Ford will use a completely different system for their two assembly programs!
Relative to the both the Vinfast and Lucid stories, I can’t imagine being an automaker. SO MUCH CAPITAL has to be burned through on an educated guess that enough of the public will buy your car over that of your competitors. What a sad showing Lucid’s SUV is having. As an investor, my stomach would be in knots. Same for Vinfast.
Here is a recently updated article about Lucid Gravity. It sounds like they are ramping up production, but they have a ways to go to be where they need to be. Also, is there a market for a $100K vehicle that could be an “orphan” in a year or two?
https://insideevs.com/news/768952/lucid-gravity-units-sold/
The Gravity has more range, but would the Cadillac Vistiq be close to a competitor, for about $20K less?
As far as the BMW to compete with G-Wagen, an article I saw made it sound like they would go more for the G-Wagon’s off-road capability, which almost no one uses, rather than styling to compete with the Mercedes. Kind of an X5 Rubicon.
@BMW “G Wagen”. Where I live there are many Mercedes G Wagens. Many of which are driven by females and youngsters. I don’t like the look of the side of almost all because the vehicles are equipped with freeway-ready low aspect ratio tires. It causes the proportions to be off: the body is way too high, the ground clearance is too low and the wheels look small and have “too little rubber”.
Just a few look good for my taste when they have Jeep Rubicon-style rims and tires, or even more “terrain-style”. At my gym there is one with a dark blue matte wrap, a great front bumper with winch, a roof rack with light bars, and 305 or 315 wide All Terrain KO3 tires. That one looks sharp. If BMW finds a way to make something that cool-looking for less than the $250 k of that particular G Wagen it would stand out. And I could imagine there are customers for it. They are used in the suburbs, not driven for long distances and for showing off. Then you should sell them something cool to show off. Many people lease those vehicles so it would make it easy for them.
Just like there were Jeep Wrangler owners who spend large sums of money on after market equipment to make it look sharp, and then Jeep made several versions like the Rubicon to get close to that look but at a lower price level and ready to go from the dealership.
I drive my “poor man’s G Wagen” Jeep Wrangler and after five years I am still impressed by the equipment on the vehicle: it drives very well off-road with its drivetrain equipment and the wheels while still having a noise level on the freeway at 75 miles per hour which is acceptable. The only thing you can’t do with those tires is drive fast. My daughter borrowed it and had driven 10,000 miles before I saw it again. You could see that the tires were severely worn down. I asked her what speed she drives it (she drives 80 freeway miles daily outside of Chicago): “usually 85-90 miles per hour, it drives fine on the freeway.” I told her that the tires are off-road capable tires made of a soft rubber compound and not suited for that. “I had no idea, you have never told me that.” Well, I had, trust me on that.
Tesla in Norway – I suspect Norway has a huge Tesla following, sales there I suspect are bouncing back as Elon has been shooshed lately. It shows he needs to keep his craziness to himself.
I am an optimist with Ford’s move. It reflects the innovations Tesla deployed, and they seem to be benchmarking the current best in class competitors from China. Having an appealing, low cost, volume EV is exactly what companies like Ford need, it’s the right move regardless of the speech. A winner idea provided they can make a profit with this. In this world companies like Ford need to react to current policies but need to have a plan for the next set of rules, too.
Won’t Slate still have a market to themselves, even with the upcoming Ford? I suspect Ford’s planned smaller electric truck will be an extra short bed four door super crew, while Slate is to be a two door regular cab.
Hahaha… BMW wishes it was that easy to copy an iconic, very profitable auto from a competitor that has been kicking its ass for more than 50 years in that segment.
If so, then it should develop a Porsche 911 clone. Decades ago it was reported that the 911 which has sold MUCH more than 1 MILLION copies to date, makes it a profit of $20k per unit made. THAT IS NOT IN 2025 $, in case any fools will say “so what”? IT IS MORE THAN $50k in 2025 worthless dollars.
So why has BMW failed to make a 911 clone? Because it knows it will not be easy to duplicate the LEGEND, even if it can match the “performance”.
Competing with the 911, the only rear engine sports car in the world, would be much different from competing with a boxy lifted 4WD wagon. Everyone makes lifted 4WD wagons. Yes, the G wagen is an icon and a fashion statement for the wealthy, and would be very hard to compete with, because of that status. Still, it’s much more a very expensive Jeep Wrangler than a 911.
Kit,
Slate will certainly be in its own niche in the EV truck market. Particularly being a regular cab instead of crew cab. The regular cab would be good for local delivery drivers and some other local contract workers that need bed space more than people space.
If you compare slate to the broader truck market to include ICE, it does not look as great. The cheapest Ranger is $33K and it is a crew cab. The Ranger does have the same bed size(actually a little wider) as the slate, better tow ratings, far nicer interior, standard with AC, aluminum wheels, power windows/locks/cruise, and a 10inch touchscreen stereo with 6 speakers. Slate has a hook for a bluetooth speaker so that is something. I can guarantee that little hook will be the first broken thing on every single Slate ever made. Slate starts at $28K without a wrap and steel wheels. Want a color wrap and aluminum wheels? Who knows what that will be, but likely about the same as a Ranger.
I suspect that fleet buyers could easily get a base model Ranger XL, that is nicer and more usable overall, cheaper than a base model Slate truck. The Slate made some sense when there was a $7500 tax payer funded rebate and it could be had in its base form for $20K. That is now gone. In some states where there may be state tax payer funding of vehicle purchase, the Slate may make some sense. For where I am at, it makes the most financial sense to buy a Ranger instead of the Slate. In fact it would make more sense to buy the Ranger over Fords new EV trucklet which will undoubtedly have a smaller bed. Unless there is some absolute reason that one must buy an EV trucklet, the Ranger is likely to beat it every single time. If one was to look at Chevrolet and Toyota, they would get a small size crew cab truck with the same size bed for 2K cheaper than the Ranger making the Slate even less attractive.
Slate might do better to make an ICE trucklet. Also, why not a six foot bed, or longer? S-10 offered a 7 1/2 foot bed, at least the first generation. Yeah, a base Ranger, Colorado, or Taco is a better value than Slate, if you want, or don’t mind the 211-226 inch long crew cab. The bed of a Maverick is only 6 inches shorter, and the hybrid uses barely over half as much gas.
https://carsandbids.com/auctions/3zVDVjgP/2020-porsche-taycan-turbo
Further evidence that the Tesla Model S, which is the only I would buy if I ever bought an EV, holds its value quite well, despite Sean’s tall tales, and actually does much better than other premium, flagship EVs as the godawful EQS and the not luxurious at all Porsche Taycan so-called Turbo, which sold here yesterday.
The 2020 with only 41k miles lost much more than half its value, even if you are an econ illiterate and lazily do not adjust the price new for Biden’s inflation. The sticker, which you can see in the photo section (it i the first photo under ‘docs’) was $180,000, and, five hours before the auction is over, the highest bid is only $65,000, or about $45k in 2020 dollars. Which is exactly…. one fourth of the sticker price!
correction above, obviously the Taycan auction is still going on at this time, so cross out that it was ‘sold yesterday’. As I wrote, thee is still five hours to ggo. I bet it does not meet reserve, but click on the link in 5 hours and find out.
Model S holds its value relatively well, compared to some expensive EVs, especially EQS, but the S showcased here a couple days ago lost 72% of its value in 6 years. That’s starting with 2019 dollars. It lost 78% if you convert the 2019 price to 2025 dollars. Yes, that’s not as bad as some other expensive EVs, but if that Taycan sells at $65K, it lost only 72% with the original price converted to 2025 dollars. Meanwhile, a, say, 2019 Camry hybrid loses about 50% of its value in 6 years. No EVs hold their value very well.