AD #3151 – Hyundai, Aptiv & Lyft Ready for Robotaxis; GM Not Confident in LG Chem; Will Human Drivers Be Banned?
August 31st, 2021 at 11:46am
Listen to “AD #3151 – Hyundai, Aptiv and Lyft Ready for Robotaxis; GM Not Confident in LG Chem; Will Human Drivers Be Banned?” on Spreaker.
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Runtime: 10:49
0:07 Lotus Moves to Wuhan, China
1:16 GM Not Confident in LG Chem
2:06 Tesla Aiming for India
3:40 Hyundai, Aptiv & Lyft Ready for Robotaxis
4:29 Will Human Drivers Be Banned?
5:47 TRW Makes Quiet Brake Pads for EVs
7:23 Ford Makes EV Charging Simple
8:46 Motorcycles with ABS Are Far Safer
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LOTUS MOVES TO WUHAN, CHINA
Lotus is one of the most storied names in the auto industry. Founded by Colin Chapman, it was renowned for its lightweight cars. Lotus and Ford collaborated a lot in the 1960s, developing cars, both on and off the track. After Chapman died in 1982 Lotus went through a variety of different owners, including General Motors, a private investment group and Proton, the Malaysian automaker. Then Chinese automaker Geely bought Proton, and now Lotus is moving its global headquarters to Wuhan, China. It’s also building an assembly plant there with the capability of making 150,000 electric cars a year. And it just signed a deal with NIO to develop high end EVs. Here’s our Autoline Insight. Lotus is respected globally for its engineering prowess. But it’s never been financially successful as an automaker. Now we’ll have to wait and see if Geely can make a go of it.
GM NOT CONFIDENT IN LG CHEM
GM hasn’t been shy about blaming LG Chem for Chevy Bolts catching fire over battery problems. And now the automaker says it isn’t confident LG can make defect-free batteries. Because of that, GM is holding off on repairing the 141,000 Bolt EVs and EUVs it recently had to recall. It’s also keeping its Orion Assembly plant idled until it’s confident the fixes for the batteries are safe. GM is monitoring LG’s manufacturing process to try and find the defect. The automaker and LG are negotiating on how much LG has to pay for the cost of the recall which is $1.8 billion.
TESLA AIMING FOR INDIA
Tesla is another step closer to selling its EVs in India. The company just received permission from the government to make or import four models. But it will be a tough market to crack. EVs only account for 1% of sales in the country and Tesla’s are much more expensive than the EVs already sold there. On top of that, India has high import tariffs which will add to the price. However, if demand is high enough, Elon Musk has hinted it could open a factory in India at some point. And dangling out the prospect of a factory could get Indian officials to reduce the taxes on EVs.
HYUNDAI, APTIV & LYFT READY FOR ROBOTAXIS
On an earnings call with investors recently, GM CEO Mary Barra said that autonomous cars are only quarters away, not years away. And there sure is a lot of activity on the AV homefront. The latest comes from Hyundai which just unveiled its robotaxi based on the Ioniq 5 EV. Hyundai and the supplier Aptiv formed a joint venture called Motional to develop AVs. And they’re turning the Ioniq into a Level 4 AV that will be used by Lyft, the ride hailing company in 2023. So that riders will be fully aware that they’re getting into a robotaxi with no human driver, Motional and Hyundai made no effort to hide the 30 sensors on the roof and doors.
WILL HUMAN DRIVERS BE BANNED?
So in the future, will autonomous cars lead to a ban on human drivers? A study from ID TechEx predicts that’s exactly what’s going to happen. It says human driving will be banned by 2050. It’s all about safety. AVs will be far safer than humans, says the study. It bases that on analysis of autonomous disengagements reported to the California DMV. Waymo and Cruise are currently traveling about 30,000 miles between disengagements, and that’s doubling every year. At that rate, by 2046 AVs will be able to travel 3 million miles between disengagements. That suggests traffic accidents could drop to only 1 a year. Well, here’s our Autoline Insight. We don’t think driving will ever be banned. And we present Toyota’s Guardian philosophy as Exhibit #1. That’s where drivers can do all the driving they want, but the car will never let them get in an accident. It’s as if a guardian angel is hovering above the car making sure that nothing bad ever happens.
TRW MAKES QUIET BRAKE PADS FOR EVS
EVs are so quiet that you can hear the brake pads engage, especially when backing up at low speed. So TRW, which is part of the ZF Group, is coming out with aftermarket brake pads that are specially made for EVs. Called Electric Blue, the pads are made from a new material that not only significantly reduces interior noise levels but also vibrations during braking. And they emit 45% less brake dust so you don’t have to spend more time looking at or cleaning dirty wheels. Right now it looks like these Electric Blue brake pads are only available in Europe. There’s 21 different part numbers that cover EVs that make up 98% of sales in Europe and 30 part numbers for hybrids.
FORD MAKES EV CHARGING SIMPLE
EV charging can be confusing to the general public. There’s different levels of charging, different charge rates and the size of the on-board chargers are different. To make things easier Ford created a software program that combines different charging networks into one platform. Darren Palmer, the head of all battery electric vehicles at Ford, fills in the details.
“We made the system, it automatically routes for you. You just say what you want to do and it tells you how to do it, ‘so I want to go to Chicago.’ It will automatically add chargers, it will find the fastest ones of the best quality and offer those up to you. By the way you get 250 kilowatts free, maybe that’s four charges, you get that free with the car to get you started. And then those ones, you’ll drive there plug-in and take 10 seconds to automatically authorize, you check its working then walk away. And that’s the experience a lot of people will have. You don’t need to get into which type, which phase, how many, it doesn’t matter. The system has it all online and it tells you and that’s a curated set. There are more chargers but they’re not in our curated set, in other words the quality could be random and we haven’t selected them for those reasons.”
We’ve used Ford’s system and it’s definitely better than everyone else’s except Tesla’s.
MOTORCYCLES WITH ABS ARE FAR SAFER
Passenger cars in the U.S. must be equipped with anti-lock braking systems but that’s not the case with motorcycles. And a new study from the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety shows motorcycles equipped with ABS are safer. It looked at 65 models with ABS made between 2013 and 2019 and found that bikes equipped with the system were in 22% fewer fatal crashes per 10,000 registered vehicle years. A registered vehicle year is equal to one motorcycle registered for one year. The IIHS has been calling on NHTSA to mandate ABS for motorcycles since 2013 but that hasn’t happened. However, the feature is becoming more common, it’s standard on half of 2020 models and it’s optional on another quarter.
Nissan went to the head of the class when it finally redesigned the Frontier. The changes it made are significant, and we’re going to get into that on Autoline After Hours this Thursday. Melaina Vasko is a senior manager at Nissan’s U.S. Tech Center where the vehicle was developed. If you’ve got questions about the Frontier you’d like us to ask Melaina, tweet it to us or drop an email to viewermail@autoline.tv. Then join Gary and I on Thursday for some of the best insights into what’s going on in the automotive industry.
And that wraps up today’s report. Thanks for watching.
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Comments (36)
August 31st, 2021 at 12:12 pm
“Better than anyone else, except Tesla”
August 31st, 2021 at 12:15 pm
With Lotus setting up HQ in Wuhan,brand Lotus will soon be spread like a virus.
August 31st, 2021 at 12:16 pm
John; I fail to see how Elon hinting at building a plant in India would prompt them to lower any tariffs. Seems the Tariffs work in their favor and would help push the need for a local plant, where reducing tariffs may make importing them a sufficient source.
August 31st, 2021 at 12:20 pm
The electronic controls on modern motorcycles, including ABS, have indeed improved safety a lot.
August 31st, 2021 at 12:20 pm
It sounds like TRW’s new brake pads would benefit all vehicles; wonder why the “EV” determination.
I wouldn’t say that Nissan’s Frontier has moved to the ‘head of the class’; more rightly, got promoted into the same class (as its competitors).
I’m on GM’s side (about calling out LG’s batteries); if they were less robust they would incur the ire (of others) of not doing enough. I.E., and reported earlier: Ford and Firestone’s tire debackle.
August 31st, 2021 at 12:29 pm
ABS would be a good option on motorcycles if some have the ability to turn it on and off. Many sport bikes and cross-over dirt bikes do have riding styles where they would not want ABS in use. For most of the cruisers that are road use only I’m sure most of those riders would be fine with it being on 100%.
August 31st, 2021 at 12:38 pm
The sale of Lotus to Geely also reflects the saddening trend facing the U.S..
According to Axios, about 51% of the auto and supplier work force are employed by companies based in other countries. What is even more sisheartening is 69% of all manufacturing jobs in the last 5 years were created by varios global companies.
I have a tough time trying to reason why foreign investors are flocking to the U.S to manufacture goods to our demanding public, yet our own manufactures show no interest to grow their market here at home.
It’s tiring to here the sad songs from American makers that the U.S. is not as profitable, knowing the global manufactures doing business here are doing just fine and are flourishing.
IMO our manufacturing sector has lost not only its heart but also lost its soul!
August 31st, 2021 at 12:41 pm
5 Wasn’t part of the Ford/Firestone tire debacle the result of Ford’s saying to under-inflate the tires, so the trucky early generation Explorer would ride better?
August 31st, 2021 at 12:51 pm
There is one area where the Frontier is “head of the class.” It remains gas hog of the class.
ABS is much more useful on motorcycles than on cars. Generally, if you skid much on a bike, you will crash, and if you crash, you are likely to get hurt. On four wheels, you can do a lot of sliding without crashing, or getting hurt. It so happens that my bikes don’t have ABS, and one even has a carburetor, but if I ever get another new bike, it will have ABS.
August 31st, 2021 at 12:53 pm
#8 True,from my recollection it was under inflated to give softer ride, but often caused overheating sidewalls,i think, not as many incidents in Canada, but in warmer climate was disaster waiting to happen.
August 31st, 2021 at 2:12 pm
cwolf , It’s hard to be profitable when manufacturing in the US is held to different standards than the rest of the globe. Our companies have to deal with EPA and OSHA standards that in many countries barely exist if at all. Then throw in the wage gap. Just weeks ago they talked about the drastic wage gap with Mexico and it’s even worse with Chinese companies.
August 31st, 2021 at 2:16 pm
So if GM is dragging it’s feet on replacing those batteries what are they doing for their customers that are now out of a a car? I doubt they gave them all loaners especially with the chip shortage limiting stock so bad. Sounds like a sure fire way of pissing off a customer enough to never buy from GM again.
August 31st, 2021 at 2:37 pm
5 Maybe the “EV” brake pads are extra short lived, which would be ok for an EV which does a lot of its braking by regen, while not being so good for a regular car?
August 31st, 2021 at 2:47 pm
12 Yep which is probably why they are so adamant about placing blame with LG. However I doubt that will help in fact will probably add frustration to the customer. Nothing worse then when a job is messed up and everyone starts pointing fingers elsewhere.. The sole responsibility still falls on GM and maybe they didn’t monitor LG enough. Maybe they didn’t preform or require stringent enough tests for the battery pack. It is an ever changing new tech and knowing what situations to test for may not have been apparent at the time. Either way it still is GM’s fault in my eyes as they just contract LG to make a battery. I would expect LG to push back on that recall claim if they did all the testing required by GM.
If LG falsified tests or knew of a problem that was swept under the rug then sure they hold full responsibility for the fires. Either way this story isn’t over.
August 31st, 2021 at 3:01 pm
8 & 10. False. The issue was a tire manufacturing quality problem within Firestone’s Mexico plant. Firestone tried to blame the Explorer, but the Explorer was proven safe.
Initial Explorer production exclusively used Firestone tires. Later, Ford dual sourced to both Firestone and Michelin. There were zero issues with the Michelin tires.
While enduring Firestone’s public accusations, Ford was busy reverse-engineering Firestone’s manufacturing data (which Firestone dragged their feet in providing; then only providing a mountain of computer coded data). Ford found the source of Firestone’s manufacturing defects, after which Firestone quietly quit blaming Ford. In reality, Firestone’s actions were criminal and libelous, but their weeks/months of throwing mud at the Explorer is what most people remember.
You may ask why Ford didn’t throw mud back at Firestone. Two reasons. 1. There were tens of millions of good Firestone tires on the road, with owners that didn’t need to doubt the quality of they tires/vehicles. 2. The Ford and Firestone families had a long history together… from Henry and Harvey in the early 1990s… to William Clay Ford Sr. married Martha Firestone in 1947. Ford respected that history, even though Bridgestone has owned the Firestone trier brand since 1988.
August 31st, 2021 at 3:16 pm
Tesla in India – Plant in that country would be a frustrating mistake. Musk is flustered by California & Germany bureaucracy, India on that regard is plain awful. I think Tesla will sell in India, lots of tech money in that country. Factory? Probably not.
Blue break pads – Electrified cards don’t really benefit from less break dust (regen, I never had to clean brake dust), yet ICE cars this is a big nuisance. Do they sell this for ICE cars, too?
August 31st, 2021 at 3:18 pm
I have confidence that GM will handle the Bolt recall. We can live for now charging to 90% and not letting it get below 1/3 BUT for how long?
If we have to wait a year for a new battery, that’s a totally different calculation than if we got it in November.
I cannot see even the most accommodating owner willing to over-winter the car outside with a crippled battery. I am sure the guys that clean the driveway will agree too.
We had agreed with GM to move to the Bolt EUV but that’s not going to work now, is it?
August 31st, 2021 at 3:23 pm
Blue brake pads: Since we so infrequently use the brakes on the EV, dust isn’t an issue. What is an issue is rotors rusting out and getting pitted from lack of use. How about a brake pad that is hard on the rotors so it will clean off the rust the few times it’s used. When we replaced all 4 rotors, they had lots of life left but were seriously pitted with rust.
August 31st, 2021 at 3:24 pm
I had a friend who was a supervisor where ford built the explorer and he said they reduced the tire pressure cut down on road noise instead of more insulation.
August 31st, 2021 at 3:46 pm
Sad, but not surprising, news about Lotus. It’s been Chinese-owned for a while, so the move is not unexpected. Anyone want to buy a ‘73 Europa? I couldn’t buy anything new from them now, but unfortunately that rules out at least one Buick too.
August 31st, 2021 at 4:21 pm
15 Is Decatur, Illinois part of Mexico? That’s where the tires were made, according to two articles I found.
Did Ford continue to recommend under-inflating the tires (26psi) after they started using Michelin? I don’t know the answer to that one.
August 31st, 2021 at 5:51 pm
Some may find this interesting:
Today, the last refiner producing leaded gas stopped production.
As bad as leaded gas has been environmentally, my British sports car runs best using it. Although all the modifications to use non-leaded were made during the restoration, the car does not run normal without it. The gas tank can be filled twice with a bottle of lead additive and not many miles are driven per year. But just as a precaution, I might have to buy cases of this stuff if the additive becomes no longer available.
August 31st, 2021 at 5:54 pm
Save me from the EV missionaries, buy a Bolt but do not charge overnight in my garage!! No thank you! I will keep my Mercedes 300D and watch the rolling black outs in California enhance the EV ownership experience.
August 31st, 2021 at 6:02 pm
Kit, it was 23 over 20 years ago when the hysteria transpired. I recall the Firestone tires were sourced from both plants. The Mexico plant had no/little process control. Ford de-sourced all Firestone for a few years due to lack of trust. Years latter, Ford started to source some specialty tires… but maintained a restriction from the Mexico plant.
The tire pressure specifications applied equally tomFirestone, GY, and Michelin. The change in tire pressure specification occurred after several years of side-by-side to the quality experience s with GoodYear and later Michelin offerings… which proved the vehicle and its tire specs were not the source of the problem).
Firestone acknowledged 26 PSI was not a problem, but started to blame vehicle owners for vehicle overloading and lax attention to tire pressure (e.g., letting the PSI drop below 19)… as Firestone learned Ford wasn’t going to all them to continue their disparaging campaign.
At the end of the day, 5 new federal safety rules were imposed on all vehicles: 1. tire pressure monitoring system mandate, 2, added side air bag/curtain specifications, 3. added roof strength specifications, 4. electronic stability control, and 5. the TREAD Act defect reporting mandate.
Prior to this Firestone saga, older readers will recall tires were warranted by the tire manufacturer, not the vehicle OEM. In other words, vehicle OEMs were highly reliant on tire manufacturers for a complete picture of the quality of the tires. For the last (nearly) 20 years, smart OEMs no longer expose their reputation to such risk and have in-house tire/rubber technical expertise.
August 31st, 2021 at 6:02 pm
22 Interesting. To me, one of the greatest changes during my 59 years of driving was getting rid of leaded gas, and not only for environmental and health reasons. Now, spark plugs last 200,000 miles, rather than 10,000, as with leaded gas.
August 31st, 2021 at 7:29 pm
22 How does your C run badly with unleaded premium? Does it ping on acceleration? Did they quit making low lead av gas?
August 31st, 2021 at 8:05 pm
yeah, Kit, pinging is a biggie and the idle is rougher when hot.
You have been around the block more than once my friend. Back in the day I did use AV gas. As I recall the best blend was just over 1/4 tank of EV. A petroleum engineer who instructed one of my classes helped me establish the best blend for the car.
August 31st, 2021 at 8:33 pm
27 cvont.)
Kit , as you know, leaded gas was easier on valve seats on older cars. The ones in the “C” are hardened and less of an issue.
It took me ahile to realize that most premium fuel has some amount of ethanol. Because my car is an original restoration, Ethanol eats the crap out of the natural rubber seals.
You might also be interested that, besides a lead additive, I also use a fuel stabelizer or ethanol treatment.
I don’t take any chances with this engine. Parts ( original) are getting hard to get or cost a heafty sum.
August 31st, 2021 at 9:53 pm
27,28 Thanks for info.
September 1st, 2021 at 8:24 am
28) I went through that pain with my older cars and ethanol fuels. Fortunately as these seals leaked they got replaced with updated variants which can resist the corrosive ethanol blends so I don’t worry about it too much anymore. All of my older cars are after leaded gas was phased out so I don’t worry about lead additives either. There are stations, generally located around race tracks, that offer 0% ethanol fuel. That would be an option for you to get around the issues with ethanol blends at least. This website has a list of fuel stations with ethanol free fuels. I don’t know who updates the list so it might be worth calling the listed station first to verify before driving there.
https://www.pure-gas.org/
September 1st, 2021 at 9:15 am
There are 4 or 5 stations selling E-0 near my place in Florida, probably mainly for boat motors. Many, or most outboards from the ’60s and earlier had shellac coated cork carb floats, not good with ethanol. Maybe other marine engines had ethanol problems more recently than cars.
September 1st, 2021 at 9:32 am
I have used boat gas on occasion. The octane rating is a mid-grade and good for most driving.
I try to use a higher octane when running higher rpms, like exxpressway driving. The difference isn’t all that great but it is noticeable.
September 1st, 2021 at 9:47 am
Leaded fuel – Stabilizer, etc – Many years ago a friend of mine at Oldsmobile advised that they could not have spent enough money to improve engine life as much as using unleaded fuel did.
In addition, a number of years later another OEM had some issues with durability on vehicles sold to the Middle East which used leaded fuel. By this time that OEM had modified engines to provide good durability on un-leaded fuel & had to modify engines for leaded fuel.
While I bemoaned the reduction in CR & performance due to unleaded fuel back in 1971, current technology has done wonders for performance, economy, & emissions.
Our Fusion Sport is rated at 325HP net which is probably a little more that my 1970 Corvette rated at 350HP Gross.
I currently fill my gas cans for tractors, lawnmower, chain saws, etc with ethanol free fuel, & put StaBil Marine in the cans for good measure.
Sorry for so many electrons,
September 1st, 2021 at 11:04 am
The oldest yard equipment I currently use is a 1977 John Deere lawn tractor, which is fine with E-10. I’d need ethanol-free gas if I wanted to use my 1950s Lawn Boy, which has a shellac coated cork carb float.
September 1st, 2021 at 11:24 am
“GM is holding off on repairing the 141,000 Bolt EVs and EUVs it recently had to recall.”
And this is how you treat a customer? Take care of the customer now (while you still have one) then figure out whos to blame and how to sort out the financial details later.
September 1st, 2021 at 12:09 pm
35 Do they even have a way to “fix them now”? Probably not. What a mess, though.